March 6, 2012

The misguided attack on Sandra Fluke continues, displaying irritating ignorance about women law students.

Robert Stacy McCain, I'm looking at you. Rush Limbaugh has apologized, but McCain bullies on:
Rather belatedly, we are becoming aware that this supposedly typical Georgetown coed is not very typical at all...
McCain links to a blog post from The College Politico, which begins:
Sandra Fluke is being sold by the left as something she’s not. Namely a random co-ed from Georgetown law who found herself mixed up in the latest front of the culture war who was simply looking to make sure needy women had access to birth control. That, of course, is not the case.

As many have already uncovered Sandra Fluke she is, in reality, a 30 year old long time liberal activist who enrolled at Georgetown with the express purpose of fighting for the school to pay for students’ birth control. She has been pushing for mandated coverage of contraceptives at Georgetown for at least three years...
Random co-ed?! She's a law student! I've been in law schools since 1978, and I've never heard female law students called "co-eds." What the hell is a co-ed? Even as a word for female undergraduates, it's like you're from 1931. Here's the original teenage heartthrob, Rudy Vallée, singing his great old college song, "Betty Co-ed":
Betty Co-ed has lips of red for Harvard,
Betty Co-ed has eyes of Yale's deep blue,
Betty Co-ed's a golden head for Princeton,
Her dress I guess is black for old Purdue!
I first learned the names of famous universities hearing that song on an LP of college songs that my parents had. The cover photo had rows of pretty girls each holding up a pennant with the name of a college on it.
Betty Co-ed's a smile for Pennsylvania,
Her heart is Dartmouth's treasure, so 'tis said,
Betty Co-ed is loved by every college boy,
But I'm the one who's loved by Betty Co-ed!
Here's the 1931 Max Fleischer film, featuring a Betty Boop prototype and Rudy Vallée saying "hi ho!" and starting a bouncing-ball singalong:



Now, Betty has a lot of boyfriends. Some may even call her a "slut." That was back in the day when a girl on campus caused quite a hubbub. Did Betty put out? What birth-control did Betty use? How much did it cost? Who paid? I don't know, but how many voters of today remember what college was like back when Rudy Vallée was making women swoon?

Now, Vallée's a fascinating character in the history of pop culture:
Vallée... was perhaps the first complete example of the 20th century mass media pop star. Flappers mobbed him wherever he went. His live appearances were usually sold out, and even if his singing could hardly be heard in those venues not yet equipped with the new electronic microphones, his screaming female fans went home happy if they had caught sight of his lips through the opening of the trademark megaphone he sang through.
Vallee had a gentle voice:
Vallée became the most prominent and, arguably, the first of a new style of popular singer, the crooner. Previously, popular singers needed strong projecting voices to fill theaters in the days before the electric microphone. Crooners had soft voices that were well suited to the intimacy of the new medium of the radio.
Ah, the radio! You can't sound too harsh on the radio, especially when you're pouring your sounds into the ears of women. I know one older woman who, finding Rush too harsh, has moved on Bill Bennett, who seems caring.

But back to my point: co-ed.  This is an old-fashioned label to stick on a woman, and it shouldn't be used anymore even to apply to undergraduates. But you just sound ignorant to call a female law student a "co-ed." And that ignorance continues with this talk of Sandra Fluke not being "a random co-ed." None of the students at an elite law school like Georgetown are "random." There's an elaborate, multi-factored admissions process, and it specifically looks for applicants who aren't coming straight from college but have taken time and shown engagement with social and political issues.

A "30 year old long time liberal activist" sounds exactly like the kind of person who would apply to law school and get accepted with enthusiasm, because the schools want students who will contribute to the classroom discussions about the things we talk about in law school, like sex discrimination. This is what classroom diversity means. And we want students who will take their law school education and use it different ways, especially in political activism. So what if Fluke "enrolled at Georgetown with the express purpose of fighting for the school to pay for students’ birth control"? I have no idea if that's why she selected Georgetown, but it's not a bad thing, it's not something law schools don't like, and it's not an unusual orientation for a law student to have.

McCain also tells us that Fluke has argued that it's sex discrimination for insurance not to cover "gender-reassignment" surgery. Sorry, this is typical law-journal material. Of course, an advocate in the category she belongs to would make arguments like this. Argue with these arguments all you want. But it doesn't make Sandra Fluke some nefarious pseudo law student. She sounds like a typical excellent law student at an elite law school.

Which is to say: the personal put-downs sound old-fashioned and sexist.

The right wing stepped in it with Fluke. Having stepped in it, they keep smushing around in it.

As a woman, as a law professor, as a woman law professor, I don't want to be seen anywhere near these guys. Could you start acting normal about women participating in public debate?

Now let's have a serious debate about insurance. Yeah. It's not much fun at all. But you've got to quit having your fun with women and sex — in this context! — or you are going to alienate more and more women voters — and men voters — every day. Good lord! It's super Tuesday. We should be talking about Mitt Romney, not Sandra Fluke. Yeah: Mitt Romney and insurance. Boring. Too bad.

503 comments:

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Love said...

kimsch - Dental insurance is a farce, but making it sound like it has something to do with this...is silly.

sonicfrog said...

I hope Fluke is smarter than Cindy Sheehan and not push her 15 minutes beyond what is needed by the Dem party at the present time. If she thinks she has a forum beyond this for her views and activism, she will find herself abandoned by the Dems just as was Sheehan.

She's probably smarter than Cindy Sheehan and Christine O'Donnell put together.

Brian Brown said...

November 3, 2011:
(Reuters) - Thirty large and profitable U.S. corporations paid no income taxes in 2008 through 2010


Guess who was President during that time?

You're not going to vote for Obama because he lets these corporations get away with this, right?

*GIGGLE*

Tom Spaulding said...

Whining about the woman just makes you look dumber by the minute.

What does whining about me "whining" make you look like, Lib?

It's fun arguing with 13-year olds, too. They "don't give a fuck" where you get your facts and are convinced name-calling and swearing are valuable debate tools. In reality, it's a manifestation of their lizard brain's reaction to the pain of cognitive dissonance.

Put some ice on it, Love.

bagoh20 said...

A proper diet of healthy food is certainly more important and universal to good health than is contraception.

Unknown said...

I read Fluke's statements, and they would not fly in any courtroom. I know this hearing is not a courtroom but her argument was purely hearsay and appeals to emotion.

If this is the best a 3L can do, she will probably end up in politics. But that's her goal, isn't it?

dreams said...

FYI Most private companies' insurance don't provide free Viagra. It is the autos and the government that is that stupid and we know what happened to the auto companies.

sonicfrog said...

And the Democrats have successfully made giving free birth control to college students and employees of all businesses the main campaign issue. And made a winner for them

At first, this whole birth control looked like a real misstep for Obama and the Dems; a horrible miscalculation that was going to anger religious voters. But once they realized this was easy bait of the Social Conservatives, they ran with it. This should have been a political 400 yard relay. But when Democrats handed off the baton to the Republicans, they have apparently decided to make this a New York Marathon.

Love said...

Jay - Condoms don't even compare to birth control pills, et.

It's a "fact."

The reason birth control should be manadated is rather simple, that is is you understand basic math.

Birth control pills, etc. cost about $500 a year.

Giving birth cost between %6,000 -$8,000.

Any insurance company who doesn't see the financial gain in preventing unwanted pregnancies is foolish and short-sighted.

The rate of surgical birth in this country is over 35%, and costs tens of thousands of dollars. Compared to the $30 monthly cost of birth control pills, it doesn't make sense to pay for the delivery, but not the pregnancy prevention.

A woman could take birth control pills for 4 years for the same cost of one live birth that has no complications or surgery. And that doesn't count the prenatal care...or other underlying medical reasons for taking the pill.

*Health isurance policies have covered Viagra for years...and I never said it was "mandated," but why is it even covered?

John Stodder said...

Not to sound like a sexist, non-RINOs, but what I think Ann Althouse is saying is, Sandra Fluke is a honey trap for the right.

In other words, maybe she's an activist rather than a mere student who emerged from the mass of desperate students searching for financial help for their basic needs.

So what? You have to always rise at the bait and look like asses in the process?

If I were a liberal tactician, I'd serve you folks up a Sandra Fluke once a month... a seemingly flawed messenger, whose flaw was like catnip to you, and you'd fall all over yourselves in this really jerky way to show why my messenger was flawed, and all that would do is spread my message for me, while making you look bad.

It's time to start focusing on the message. If you think Sandra Fluke is wrong, say it this way. Sandra Fluke is an important voice to be heard from, and I think her contributions to the debate were exceedingly helpful and thought provoking. I believe she is wrong, however, on the following grounds....

Would that be so hard? You gotta call her a slut to get your point across, then you shouldn't be public with your politics.

Hagar said...

I also think movie theaters should be required to provide free popcorn and sodypop for their patrons.

Tom Spaulding said...

So "Reuters" is the final word here? A "study"?

They were with the corporations when they filed their taxes? Were by their side when their mailed them in ?

And then they stuck with them over 2008-2010, monitoring their every financial transaction?

Get your head out of your ass.

Being a clueless Lib is easy and fun. Try it at home!

Chuck66 said...

Viagara is covered because it fixes a medical issue. A guy unable to get an erection. And my guess is that there is a co-pay.

Actually I don't think it should be covered, but that is the reason.

How often do condoms fail? It seems like you are trying to find any reason for the taxpayers and employers to pay for this lady's birth control pills.

Hey, my Dad takes blood pressure pills. Why does he have a co-pay?

Love said...

Advertisers who are saying..bye-bye cretin:

AccuQuote, ServiceMagic, Polycom, Hadeed Carpet and Thompson Creek Windows, AOL, stamps.com, Deere & Co., Geico, St. Vincent’s Medical Center in Connecticut, Bethesda Sedation Dentistry, Cascades Dental, Allstate, Sears and men's retailer Bonobos.

Brian Brown said...

Love said...
Jay - Condoms don't even compare to birth control pills, et.

It's a "fact."


What is this supposed to mean?

The failure rate of oral contraception is 5%

The failure rate of condoms is 14%.

Some "fact" you have going there, bozo.

Freeman Hunt said...

JAC's article does not effectively tackle the question about cost.

Some alternatives cost more.

What ones and how much do they cost?

Nevermind. I already know because I'm of the age for this sort of thing. They don't cost $3000.

Fluke was full of it.

One may be able to find some exotic method that costs this much, (Perhaps having semen removed after sex by a virginal monk brandishing a golden spoon.) but it would be such as outlier as to be irrelevant. Her argument acts like $1000 a year is the norm; it's not.

And in any case, less expensive alternatives, condoms for example, are available in lieu of any high cost option.

Brian Brown said...

The reason birth control should be manadated is rather simple, that is is you understand basic math.

Birth control pills, etc. cost about $500 a year.

Giving birth cost between %6,000 -$8,000.


Hysterical.

Um, the cost of abstinence is zero and the effectiveness is 100%.

You are an idiot beyond belief.

damikesc said...

Condoms sometimes don't work.

It's a fact.


The success rate of the pill isn't 100%, either.

Just sayin'.

And why is Viagra covered?

I fail to see the relevance. Are condoms covered by insurance?

I ask because that is an actual comparative product for men.

It's still nothing more than the publishing organization's take on the woman and her motives...for whatever reason.

Yes, quoting her is quite unfair. How little do you think of women?

Romney has come under fire for his 2009 USA Today op-ed in recent days. In it, he suggested that President Obama look to Massachusetts, and adopt an individual mandate as part of national health care reform.

So quoting a man is fair, but quoting a woman isn't?

Misogynist.

Brian Brown said...

*Health isurance policies have covered Viagra for years...and I never said it was "mandated," but why is it even covered?


Who cares. It is irrelevant to the discussion.

dreams said...

The Republicans have done nothing wrong. We don't like having to pay birth control costs for young women. Read Mona Charen's article in NRO. When insurance companies are forced to provide it free than the cost of insurance goes up for everyone.

Methadras said...

You are out in left field on this one prof.

Rusty said...

So. She really is a slut.

Love said...

Chuck66 "Viagara is covered because it fixes a medical issue."

So do birth control pills.

It's a "fact."

1. Irregular menstrual periods
2. Benign breast disease
3. Pelvic inflammatory disease
4. Functional cysts
5. Ectopic pregnancies are prevented
6. Prevent certain ovarian and endometrial cancers

Other than that...

edutcher said...

More to the point, if the polls mentioned in the Taranto piece are to be believed (excluding the skewed WSJ/NBC poll, of course), this thing is shaping up as a wash for the Lefties, maybe a slight loss.

And, yes, it's the Lefties and Ann that are keeping this going today.
The rest of us left Ms Fluck behind yesterday.

As someone noted, if this is going to be Ann's excuse for voting for Zero again, it won't fly.

damikesc said...

The memory hole is active today. Ive lost multiple posts here.

Things are a little slow.

Just look at the trolls.

Love said...

"As many have already uncovered Sandra Fluke she is, in reality, a 30 year old long time liberal activist who enrolled at Georgetown with the express purpose of fighting for the school to pay for students’ birth control."

We're to believe she's so intent on getting this done...that she literally enrolled and has stuck it out for three years...all so the university would pay for her contraceptives?


Out of her own mouth, too.

Facts are really a bitch, aren't they?

Amartel said...

"Republicans need to be fact-based and smart on anything that has to do with science.
And they need to respect women."

And the Democrats are all about the science and respect for women.
NOT. Oh, please!
Rush called Fluke out on her bullshit and obviously didn't put pull punches doing it. He assumed she was an adult not a little girl. He assumed she could take a joke. He assumed she would argue her point honestly.
Wrong assumptions when dealing with the humorless squalling perpetually bitter left.

So this "respect for women" thing: Generally speaking, isn't it more respectful to treat a person as an individual first rather than as a subset of a greater herd? Do we have to have this blanket respect for electricians or Canadians? Of course not, we look to see if their worth it first. What does this actually mean, "respect women"? Other than "swallow nonsense narrative of oppression and powerlessness"?

When the police arrived to break up protests in the 60s/70s, one tactic was to put "chicks up front" on the assumption that the males could hide behind the females because cops would be less inclined to beat up girls. How courageous. And how sexist. Well, this bunch of assholes is still hiding behind owned female pawns like Fluke and there should be no hesitation or qualms about pointing that out.

That's respect.

damikesc said...

The reason birth control should be manadated is rather simple, that is is you understand basic math.

Birth control pills, etc. cost about $500 a year.

Giving birth cost between %6,000 -$8,000.


Only way your policy makes ANY sense is that for a woman to get the birth control benefit, she would have to completely forego ANY coverage benefits for giving birth. Given that women take birth control, by and large, to control the TIMING of giving birth, not in totally avoiding it, this is a major money loser for insurance companies (proof: that it isn't covered as is).

Otherwise, the company gets the joy of paying for BOTH --- which is a significant increase in cost with no ability to offset with a tiny increase in the premiums for women who want that coverage.

A woman could take birth control pills for 4 years for the same cost of one live birth that has no complications or surgery.

And when she has the child, that same company gets to pay for that procedure ON TOP of having paid for BC for years as well.

Win!

Viagara is covered because it fixes a medical issue. A guy unable to get an erection. And my guess is that there is a co-pay.

Odds are, a woman's hormone replacement therapy would similarly be covered.

Getting the body to function properly is arguably a reason for insurance. Preventing it from operating properly, which BC does, is not.

Love said...

dreams - Bullshit.

Any insurance company who doesn't see the financial gain in preventing unwanted pregnancies is foolish and short-sighted.

The rate of surgical birth in this country is over 35%, and costs tens of thousands of dollars. Compared to the $30 monthly cost of birth control pills, it doesn't make sense to pay for the delivery, but not the pregnancy prevention.

A woman could take birth control pills for 4 years for the same cost of one live birth that has no complications or surgery. And that doesn't count the prenatal care...or other underlying medical reasons for taking the pill.

dreams said...

*Health isurance policies have covered Viagra for years...and I never said it was "mandated," but why is it even covered?

FYI That is just not true. Most private sector Companies' insurance don't provide free Viagra. Only for the auto companies and the government which where and are going bankrupt.

And besides Viagra is for a medical condition which is not the case with birth control.

damikesc said...

Any insurance company who doesn't see the financial gain in preventing unwanted pregnancies is foolish and short-sighted.

Anybody who ignores that they will have to pay for BC AND pregnancy when the woman decides she wants a child is too dumb to take seriously. Unless you actually suspect women would give birth as frequently as possible if they couldn't get the pill gratis.

The rate of surgical birth in this country is over 35%

Thank you lawyers like John Edwards.

Compared to the $30 monthly cost of birth control pills, it doesn't make sense to pay for the delivery, but not the pregnancy prevention

The sense in paying for both is...?

Love said...

damikesc - You're wrong:

(Time Magazine/Moneyland 2/14/12)

The truth is that both insurers and employers who self-insure save money in the long run by covering contraception. So much money is saved that it makes financial sense to waive co-pays and deductibles.

A 2000 study by the National Business Group on Health estimates that not providing contraceptive coverage in employee health plans winds up costing employers 15% to 17% more than providing such coverage.

Freeman Hunt said...

And as long as we're supposedly talking about feminism, let's address this:

Woman peddles bullshit at hearing, bullshit being that birth control is cripplingly expensive.

How about instead of coming out in automatic defense of a woman, we address the fact that this woman was twisting the truth for a political agenda?

She's hardly admirable.

I feel sorry for no one involved in this. Not the fools who pushed their stupid jokes too far nor trouble with the truth Fluke.

Freeman Hunt said...

Insurance doesn't cover birth unless you opt for a maternity rider.

And birth costs are negotiable.

Love said...

dreams - What American auto companies are "going broke??"

damikesc said...

And, honestly, what more can Republicans do? The candidates criticized Rush and moved on. The Democrats are now fighting with bloggers.

Solid plan. Really.

Love said...

Freeman - Once again:

The truth is that both insurers and employers who self-insure save money in the long run by covering contraception. So much money is saved that it makes financial sense to waive co-pays and deductibles.

A 2000 study by the National Business Group on Health estimates that not providing contraceptive coverage in employee health plans winds up costing employers 15% to 17% more than providing such coverage.

cubanbob said...

Love said...
John M Auston - So you're saying all major corporations pay their fair share of taxes?

Really?

But even if they don't, WE get to pay them when buying their products?

November 3, 2011:
(Reuters) - Thirty large and profitable U.S. corporations paid no income taxes in 2008 through 2010, said a study on Thursday that arrives as Congress faces rising demands for tax reform but seems unable or unwilling to act.

What business school did YOU attend?

3/6/12 1:06 PM

How is possible to live and be so stupid? Whether or not the legal entity called the corporation pays taxes is irrelevant, the shareholders pay the taxes on the dividends. And what did you think, that the costs of government wasn't going to passed on to you?

Now NGO's and other non-profits that reap the benefits of being shareholders in those evil companies they SHOULD PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE!
And so should you. Your fair share of this year's federal spending is $25,000. Write the check or STFU. In the meantime if Fluke wants her birth control pills paid for by someone else let her bang someone will to pay for the favor.

She knew the terms of service when she applied but in her arrogance she decided it doesn't matter what the rules are, they need to change them for me.

She is an embodiment of the liberal left, I want what I want and its your obligation to give it to me. Lets see how well that works in November. I suspect you are going to get a rude surprise.

dreams said...

Having babies is a normal part of life and is the only way to insure the survival of a species. It is a part of nature which is so obvious it really shouldn't have to be stated.

Love said...

Freeman "Woman peddles bullshit at hearing, bullshit being that birth control is cripplingly expensive."

Actually she didn't get to testify.

The only women who did were against coverage.

Try to keep up.

Love said...

dreams - Familar with over-population problems throughout the world?

Read up on it.

Brian Brown said...

Love said...
dreams - What American auto companies are "going broke??"


Hysterical.

Again, you are a bad parody.

damikesc said...

Time Magazine

The Magazine that SOUGHT to become a niche publication or Lefties only?

The truth is that both insurers and employers who self-insure save money in the long run by covering contraception.

Given that insurance companies have lots of guys on staff to actually see what will save them money to cover --- no, that is not the "truth".

dreams - What American auto companies are "going broke??"

You miss that whole GM bankruptcy thing?

garage mahal said...

Birth control is 19 cents per month at Walmart. #TRUTH

dreams said...

Government Bailout of GM and Chrysler and it is the government that is going bankrupt.

Love said...

cubanbob - You're actually trying to say that corporatioons don't need to pay taxes...because the shareholders and customers of the corporations will pay...picking up the slack?

Are you daft or drunk?

Brian Brown said...

Love said...
dreams - Familar with over-population problems throughout the world?


Laugh out loud funny.

There are no "overpopulation" problems.



A 2000 study by the National Business Group on Health estimates

Um, so a study from 12 years ago now is your sole source of fact.

Don't you find that a little odd, dummy?

damikesc said...

Familar with over-population problems throughout the world?

Feel free to provide examples. And tell us which people should be killed to alleviate the problem.

Note: If you don't mention anybody close to you, you're not serious about the issue --- you're just into genocide.

Brian Brown said...

Love said...

Actually she didn't get to testify.

The only women who did were against coverage.


Actually, the Democrats told the committee Chair she wouldn't testify then tried to add her at the last minute.

Idiot.

Love said...

damikesc - Whining about the publication being "leftist" has no bearing on the fact that the report is from a 2000 study by the National Business Group on Health.

Time Magazine doesn't own or poerate the organization.

Duh.

Unknown said...

key points.

Co-ed was in use at my college in the 80's and I have seen it on and off since then. No one should be offended by the usage, especially if it's the elderly. We could just as well get overly sensitive and call it ageism.

Is more lawyers in politics really a good thing?

In these modern times any discussion like this should be broadened to cover men and women, what a sense of humor means, and what ulterior motives are.

raf said...

Tax payers pay for women to be on medical leave from work [under disability] when they are pregnant, which would not happen unless they had sex. So why suddenly are conservatives upset about contraception, which is a fraction of the cost?

This is a major problem. You mean that anytime the government pays for anything, no one can ever disagree with anything that costs less?

dreams said...

We don't have an over population problem, we have a problem producing enough children to replace ourselves much less pay for all our entitlements.

damikesc said...

Um, so a study from 12 years ago now is your sole source of fact.

A study she won't link to and that was cited in a magazine that, literally, nobody actually takes seriously.

You're actually trying to say that corporatioons don't need to pay taxes...because the shareholders and customers of the corporations will pay...picking up the slack?

Oh dear lord.

OK, I'll try and make this simple:

The taxes they have to pay are factored into the price YOU pay for the product.

YOU pay their taxes when you buy their product.

chickelit said...

The rate of surgical birth in this country is over 35%, and costs tens of thousands of dollars.

C-sections on demand is under a lot of review and scrutiny right now. As we move to a European model of healthcare, their absolute number must diminish--as will dying in hospitals as a matter of course.

edutcher said...

Love said...

Freeman "Woman peddles bullshit at hearing, bullshit being that birth control is cripplingly expensive."

Actually she didn't get to testify.


No, Pelosi Galore & Co held a special dog-and-pony show just for her.

If she'd been sworn in, she might be facing perjury charges.

(depends on whut the meanin' of "is" is)

damikesc said...

Whining about the publication being "leftist" has no bearing on the fact that the report is from a 2000 study by the National Business Group on Health.

Feel free to link to this study. I need a laugh.

kathy said...

Yes, Sandra Fluke is an activist. And many are stating that like it's a dirty word. People who belong to the tea party are also activists.

But to be very clear, Sandra Fluke has is an activist AGAINST domestic violence. Sandra Fluke is an activist against human trafficking. Sandra Fluke is an activist for women's human rights.

People need to start engaging in critical thinking and do just the tiniest amount of their own research instead of listening to one very biased source.

Oh, and all of you who are dismissing Sandra Fluke as an activist? You're also activists since you took the time to post here. Way to go!

chickelit said...

@Love: Watching you morph back into Jeremy is highly entertaining--keep it up!

Moose said...

I've never understood your fascination with Rush, but answer me one thing - where is the difference between Rush calling Fluke a "slut" and Maher calling Palin a "cunt"?

Sofa King said...

November 3, 2011:
(Reuters) - Thirty large and profitable U.S. corporations paid no income taxes in 2008 through 2010, said a study on Thursday that arrives as Congress faces rising demands for tax reform but seems unable or unwilling to act.

What business school did YOU attend?


What would you say if I told you that IRS statistics show that nearly half the population of the U.S. pays NO taxes?

damikesc said...

But to be very clear, Sandra Fluke has is an activist AGAINST domestic violence. Sandra Fluke is an activist against human trafficking. Sandra Fluke is an activist for women's human rights.


Rush is opposed to drowning our children and their children in debt they didn't ask for, had no role in, but are going to be forced to pay off.

So, yeah, Rush is still more noble than Flake.

I love that she's an activist "against human trafficking". Because that pro-human trafficking lobby is a beast to deal with.

Brian Brown said...

By the way, I enjoyed this:


A 2000 study by the National Business Group on Health estimates that not providing contraceptive coverage in employee health plans winds up costing employers 15% to 17% more than providing such coverage



And in the same article:

average copayments in employer-sponsored insurance plans have increased considerably over the past decade to $49 in 2010 for ‘non-preferred’ brand-name drugs and $28 for brand-name drugs.”



Let's see if love can put 2 & 2 together on this one.

Hint: a study from 2000 isn't that relevant to today.

damikesc said...

I've never understood your fascination with Rush, but answer me one thing - where is the difference between Rush calling Fluke a "slut" and Maher calling Palin a "cunt"?

She likes Flake more than Palin.

Also, Obama likes Maher and has taken a million from him, so that washes away that sin or something.

Love said...

Jay - Did she or did she not...get to testify? I've never read anyting relating to your claim that "the Democrats told the committee Chair she wouldn't testify then tried to add her at the last minute."

But a better question is this: Why are you fools still trying to defend Issa and his panel (or the fat cretin)...at this stage of the game??

Are you that dense?

bgates said...

"30 year old long time liberal activist" sounds exactly like the kind of person who would apply to law school and get accepted with enthusiasm, because the schools want students who will contribute to the classroom discussions about the things we talk about in law school, like sex discrimination. This is what classroom diversity means.

I agree, law school does suck.

JimMuy said...

Just a word of warning for you all here: If you are paying attention to Ann's posts--what she is posting, how she is saying it--she is setting up for another vote for Obama.
Over the last few months, it's subtle, can't really directly identify it but, it's the feel of things here.
Just be aware, over the next 9 months you should notice it more; the shifts of someone as they try to rationalized a bad choice--again.
That's fine. It is her choice. But don't buy the pretense of objectivity. She is searching for confirmation of her bias.

damikesc said...

But a better question is this: Why are you fools still trying to defend Issa and his panel (or the fat cretin)...at this stage of the game??

Because some chick got called a rude name, just bow down and give her what she wants?

I think not.

Hey, why don't YOU and her supporters give her the $1000 a year to pay for it.

You know, since you're so gung-ho for her and all.

Nobody is stopping YOU from stepping up...except, well, you.

Brian Brown said...

damikesc,
Here is a link to the article love/jeremy referenced.

Note that it perpetrates the lie that "98% of sexually active Catholic women have used birth control"

So the credibility is shaky at best...

cubanbob said...

Love said...
dreams - Bullshit.

Any insurance company who doesn't see the financial gain in preventing unwanted pregnancies is foolish and short-sighted.

The rate of surgical birth in this country is over 35%, and costs tens of thousands of dollars. Compared to the $30 monthly cost of birth control pills, it doesn't make sense to pay for the delivery, but not the pregnancy prevention.

A woman could take birth control pills for 4 years for the same cost of one live birth that has no complications or surgery. And that doesn't count the prenatal care...or other underlying medical reasons for taking the pill.

3/6/12 1:27 PM

So according to you insurance companies should be required to provide birth control pills, so do then get to decide if the woman is allowed to get pregnant? Or should she be compelled to refund the insurance company the cost of the pills if she gets pregnant? It's her choice to get pregnant and her choice to stay pregnant. Or is it I choose and you must pay?

Love said...

"where is the difference between Rush calling Fluke a "slut" and Maher calling Palin a "cunt"?"

Maher is a flat out comedian.

Rush is a leader of the GOP.

If you don't think so, tell me why everybody in the GOP is scared to death of offending him?

Show me the strong language used by Bohner or Romney or Newt or Santorum relating to his over the top crude behavior.

Rialby said...

"Familar with over-population problems throughout the world?"

So, this is a eugenics argument then?

You might want to read up on fertility rates throughout the world. It would do you some good as it has some significant bearing on the viability of the Post-War Socialist experiment.

damikesc said...

Thanks for the link, Jay. That study is a joke.

dreams said...

If you're in knowing what really happened at the hearings then read James Taranto in his Best of the Web column in today's WSJ.

damikesc said...

Show me the strong language used by Bohner or Romney or Newt or Santorum relating to his over the top crude behavior.

Sure.

After you show me the Dems criticizing Maher for worse rhetoric.

Or refusing campaign donations from him.

Brian Brown said...

Love said...
Jay - Did she or did she not...get to testify? I've never read anyting relating to your claim that "the Democrats told the committee Chair she wouldn't testify then tried to add her at the last minute."


Of course you have never read anything to that effect, your ignorance is a virtue for the party you vote for.

You can read about it here. (After days of asking for a witness, they waited until the last minute, the afternoon before the hearing. They asked us to invite Rev. Barry Lynn [head of Americans United for Separation of Church and State] and Ms. Fluke. We said we’ll invite one, per standard procedure. We formally invited Rev. Lynn, and the Democrats, at 4:30 pm, changed their mind and said they wanted Fluke. We said too late. They told Rev. Lynn not to show up the next day.”)

But of course you don't give a fuck who is quoted, so I don't know why you even responded.

Clown.

dreams said...

Rush is not a leader of the GOP though he has a lot influence.

Rialby said...

So, now Obama has dragged his daughters into it saying he doesn't want to have them subjected to the same language Rush used about Fluke. What about Maher against Palin? Or any other Leftist (Man or Woman) against a person on the Right?

Smallest President Ever.

Brian Brown said...

Maher is a flat out comedian.


Who donated a million to Obama's superpac and is a noted leftists.

You left that part out.

Hagar said...

and all of the above ignores that this is not only an attack on the 1st Amemdment and the Establishment Clause, but also a breathtaking expansion of the Commerce Clause that in fact would empower a Department Secretary to require movie theaters to provide "free" popcorn and sodypop with the price of admission.

Is this among "the things we talk about in law school, like sex discrimination," etc. ?

Brian Brown said...

damikesc said...
Thanks for the link, Jay. That study is a joke.


What I find comical is that love doesn't understand that health insurance preimums have increased by more than 17% since 2000 but she is squealing about an estimate 17% cost savings in a study from 12 years ago...

Freeman Hunt said...

That CAP chart is laughable. I suppose they're relying on people never having purchased birth control or not caring about the truth to get people to believe it.

cubanbob said...

Love said...
cubanbob - You're actually trying to say that corporatioons don't need to pay taxes...because the shareholders and customers of the corporations will pay...picking up the slack?

Are you daft or drunk?

3/6/12 1:38 PM

No dear just sane, sober and intelligent unlike you who believes the fairy tales that a sheaf of legal documents called a corporation actually pays taxes. Whether the legal entity as an entity writes the check or the shareholders who get the dividend distribution write the check it's still the same amount of money.

I know this is a difficult concept for you to understand but profit equals revenue minus expenses and taxes and regulations are built in to the pricing structure to insure a profit, that is if the enterprise has any hopes of not going bankrupt.

Love said...

cubanbob - I provided the study...period.

Don't believe it, that's your prerogative.

As for Jay's inane comment relating to insurance premiums skyrocketing: I have no idea why that would represent an argument...that's the entire point of national health care.

Duh.

Love said...

damikesc "Because some chick got called a rude name, just bow down and give her what she wants?"

She was called names AFTER being turned away from the Issa panel.

Why are you idiots still defending this fool?

He fucked up. The fat cretin fucked up.

The entire GOP is suffering for it...and you continue to act as if this was some kind of good idea by both parties.

Dense.

Bender said...

Sandra Fluke is an activist against human trafficking.

The Obama Administration's idea of being against human trafficking is to demand that the groups that actually help the victims provide them contraception.

And if such groups that help trafficking victims, such as various organizations within the Catholic Church, refuse to make providing contraception a priority, then the Administration prohibits them from receiving monetary assistance.

This goes right along with the left's idea of economic assistance to Africa being to throw condoms at Africans.

edutcher said...

Love said...

where is the difference between Rush calling Fluke a "slut" and Maher calling Palin a "cunt"?

Maher is a flat out comedian.

Rush is a leader of the GOP.


Really.

What office, elective or appointive, does he hold as a Republican?

What position does he have on the RNC or any state or city Republican committee?

How many times has he spoken at the Republican National Convention or any state or city Republican conventions?

The only difference is Rush is heard by millions of people, some of whom are Republicans, some Libertarian, some non-party-affiliated Conservatives.

Maher is seen by dozens of Lefty hates on an after-hours weekend cable show.

cubanbob said...

Love said...
cubanbob - I provided the study...period.

Don't believe it, that's your prerogative.

As for Jay's inane comment relating to insurance premiums skyrocketing: I have no idea why that would represent an argument...that's the entire point of national health care.

Duh.

3/6/12 1:57 PM

How about this, insurance companies should not be required to insure things that are not insurable events. However expensive it is to give birth it is next to nothing compared to the cost of raising a kid. So according to you woman are too stupid to figure that it is cheaper to not to have a kid than to have one so other people should be compelled to provide her with birth control pills for use as intended (as opposed for a medically indicated purpose) but yet she should be allowed to be stupid on her timetable and later on get pregnant. Family planning is something that individuals should decide for themselves on their own dime. Now if an insurance company wants to offer the pills for their own business reasons they should be free to do so. But other policyholders should not be required to cover a non-insurable event which is after all what insurance is for.

Hagar said...

and if not, should it be?

Brian Brown said...

cubanbob - I provided the study...period.


Actually idiot, you provided a reference to a Web posting that does not link to the study, but rather links to testimony referenceing the study.

Moose said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Brian Brown said...

As for Jay's inane comment relating to insurance premiums skyrocketing: I have no idea why that would represent an argument...that's the entire point of national health care.


You continue to demonstrate how much a moron you are.

Let me help you, stupid.

Is medical care more expensive today than it was in 2000?
Yes.

Are insurance premiums higher today than they were in 2000?
Yes.

You keep referencing a study that took place when things were not as expensive which claims to have "saved on costs"

The fact you can't grasp this basic premise demonstrates you should stop talking about the topic.

Brian Brown said...

She was called names AFTER being turned away from the Issa panel.


Um, no.

She was called a slut after the Democrats held a pretend hearing.

Idiot.

SBVOR said...

Althouse,

Oh, PLEASE!

Now, you're whining about Fluke (accurately) being described as a "co-ed"? REALLY?

This woman AND her agenda are BOTH despicable.

And, you wonder why lawyers are universally held in such disrepute...

dreams said...

I've read NRO, Commentary Contentions, Powerline, Instapundit Betsy's page and lots of other conservatives and I haven't seen any disrespect for women. What I have seen are people who like me are offended that we are force by our government to pay for free birth control for young women. It seems to me that it is liberals who have disrespect for women. Really for all us.

Love said...

cubanbob - What makes you think corporations shouldn't have to pay income taxes?

What business course did you pick that up in?

Love said...

dreams - Where do you see an argument for the "government" to pay for birth control?

Love said...

SBVOR - "This woman AND her agenda are BOTH despicable."

And, as usual, you and others here are on the wrong side of the situation.

And why do you refer to the woman herself as being "despicable?"

In what respect?

Oh, wait... I see: You also think she's a slut and prostitute.

Is that it?

dreams said...

For those of you who are interested in knowing just how corrupt the democrats are then read James Taranto.


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203370604577263271726764402.html

Love said...

Jay- I gave the publication date and the name of the publisher.

If you can't find it...that's your problem.

damikesc said...

She was called names AFTER being turned away from the Issa panel.

She wasn't turned away. Democrats were allowed to choose who to invite and they chose Lynn. Then, after plans had been made, they changed their mind.

Her beef is with them.

Why are you idiots still defending this fool?

Only fool presently visible is you.

And I'm not defending you.

And why aren't you demanding Obama refuse Maher's donation?

I Callahan said...

Any insurance company who doesn't see the financial gain in preventing unwanted pregnancies is foolish and short-sighted

Could you point out an example that doesn't? And what does this have to do with the discussion at hand?

The issue is whether the government can force employers to pay for certain coverage. They can't, and I hope this goes all the way to the U.S.S.C., where it's sure to lose.

cf said...

Ann, I often find your blog informative and interesting and thought your coverage of the Wisconsin blowup non pareil. But I'm not as diplomatic as darling MayBee. On this thread you are full of it. You sound like Sullivan in 2008 pretending he didn't know who he was going to vote for.Pheh

dreams said...

I think people should pay for their own birth control, it isn't that expensive. If insurance is force by the government to provide free birth control then that means the cost of insurance will go up for everyone.

Love said...

dreams - The Democrats did nothing remotely "corrupt."

They merley countered the Issa.

And it looks like they've done a damn good job of it. (Obama's approval ratings with women is UP 10% over the past 30 days)

And for you or anybody else to be complaining, after listening to and reading hundreds of comments inferring that President Obama isn't even a citizen or that he's a Muslim or worse...is laughable at best.

Quit whining...and admit the GOP has blown this one big time.

SBVOR said...

Love,

1) I don't expect a Leftist such as yourself to understand why Fluke is "despicable" (all Leftists are despicable).

2) In your "mind", anybody who considers Fluke to be "despicable", automatically considers her to be a "slut" and a "prostitute"? REALLY? That's some pretty magical "thinking", even for a Leftist.

mccullough said...

College and law school are geared toward women. So you end up with Flukes.

Love said...

I Callahan - The insurance sots, etc. certainly do have something to do with the argument at hand.

Many here are whining about the cost of insurance going UP...if insurance companies have to cover such contraceptives.

Mandating birth control coverage will help women prevent unwanted pregnancies, and at the same time, save money for consumers.

1. Irregular menstrual periods
2. Benign breast disease
3. Pelvic inflammatory disease
4. Functional cysts
5. Ectopic pregnancies are prevented
6. Prevent certain ovarian and endometrial cancers

Try to keep up.

dreams said...

I think some people should take off their liberal tinted glasses and not project unattractive opinions on to the Republicans.

Love said...

"I Callahan - The insurance costs, etc. certainly do have something to do with the argument at hand."

Sorry...strange typo.

Love said...

dreams - What color are your glasses "tinted?"

Pot calling kettle...

I Callahan said...

Love makes Jeremy look like a genius.

Roger J. said...

I suspect Ms Fluke will suffer the same end as Cindy Sheehan and will long be forgotten sooner than Ms Sheehan.

dreams said...

I've have an extremely low opinion Of Obama. I think he is a socialist/communist third world like dictator president who is trying to fundamentally change our country just as he said he would do in the 2008 campaign.

SBVOR said...

Love says:

"Mandating birth control coverage will help... save money for consumers."

More magical thinking...

First, Love (falsely) assumes that, without "free" birth control from insurance providers, women will not use birth control. Sorry, love, between PP and Medicaid already providing tax payer subsidized birth control and both Wal-Mart AND Target offering birth control for $9 per month (without insurance), there are NO women for whom birth control is beyond their means.

Second, love (falsely) assumes insurance actuaries are so utterly incompetent that they have missed this shining opportunity to reduce their costs.

REALLY?

Come on, Love, not even you are stupid enough to actually believe that. Or, are you?

Face it, love, this is just another Leftist power play.

dreams said...

Love, as to tented glasses, I wasn't referring to you.

damikesc said...

And it looks like they've done a damn good job of it. (Obama's approval ratings with women is UP 10% over the past 30 days)

Which speaks well of women. Really.

"Sure, the country is tanking and we're in debt to our eyeballs. But a radio guy insulted a chick. FOUR MOAR YEARS!!!"

Thankfully, most women I know don't fall for such idiocy --- but, apparently, they are a minority of the sex.

damikesc said...

And, again: Why are you not demanding Obama refuse the Maher donation?

Why aren't you upset that no Dem has a problem with Maher calling women he dislikes names far more vulgar than Fluke was called?

Feel free to explain yourself here...if you can.

Love said...

Rush Limbaugh’s latest misogynistic tirade against Georgetown University Law Student Sandra Fluke may be the last straw for many of the shock jock’s corporate sponsors. Thousands of angry customers have been inundating dozens of Limbaugh’s corporate sponsors, demanding that they cut ties with the program.

30 advertisers so far...and counting.

And you support this cretin?

X said...

What business school did YOU attend?

Santa Monica JC

dreams said...

A lot us don't want more big government that makes us more and more dependent on big government. It turns all us into children, dependents. Isn't that what we call children who are dependent on their parents? Plus it is bankrupting our country.

Love said...

damikesc - Maher is a comedian.

The fat man is a GOP leader...whether you admit it or not.

As for President Obama not accepting the donation...it was actually a super pac...that's his prerogative, and maybe he will...but do you also think donations from those who say the President is not a citizen or that he's a Musliom or that send out emails comparing his family to apes...should be sent back?

Stop defending the fat man.

It's a waste of time.

Love said...

dreams - "A lot us don't want more big government that makes us more and more dependent on big government."

George W. Bush expanded government more than any previous President.

"President Bush increased government spending more than any of the six presidents preceding him, including LBJ." (libertarian economist Veronique de Rugy)

During his eight years in office, Bush's "anti-government" Republican administration increased the federal budget by an extraordinary 104 percent.

Where were you then??

damikesc said...

Maher is a comedian.

The fat man is a GOP leader...whether you admit it or not.


Shouldn't a comedian actually be funny once in a while?

He's a big donor to the Dems --- his donations likely dwarf Limbaugh's. No Democrat has spoken out against his repeated vile slurs of women.

...this includes you, who still will not do so.

As for President Obama not accepting the donation...it was actually a super pac...that's his prerogative, and maybe he will...but do you also think donations from those who say the President is not a citizen or that he's a Musliom or that send out emails comparing his family to apes...should be sent back?

Can you verify those donations to anybody? I'd love to see you prove your case.

I can prove my case since Maher is quite proud he gave the money.

So, you don't have a problem with Maher calling women c*nts or tw*ts. Thanks for clarifying your stance on this burning issue.

And you support this cretin?

Fluke is duplicitious, but calling her a cretin seems mean.

Love said...

X - Cool.

Santa Monica is one of my favs.

Peano said...

PeterK said...you're getting worked up over the word "co-ed"??? seriously?

Just consider the source ...

damikesc said...

George W. Bush expanded government more than any previous President.

Before Obama who dwarfed what Bush did.

During his eight years in office, Bush's "anti-government" Republican administration increased the federal budget by an extraordinary 104 percent.

Where were you then??


Why are YOU complaining when your guy is dwarfing that total with ease?

SBVOR said...

I think Love and her ilk profoundly insult all women by asserting that women should be more concerned with a politically incorrect utterance from a radio personality than with the latest assault from the Left on our liberties.

Love said...

damikesc - Whether you think Maher is funny is irrlevant.

How do you know what the fat man donates?

So you think the donations coming into the GOP coffers don't include those who call the President a Muslim or that he isn't an actual American citizen?

Yeah, right.

I don't like anybody calling woman such names, especially those who are an important part of the GOP party...which the fat man is.

Stop defending the fat man.

dreams said...

Until Obama our government spending was never more than 20 0r 21% of GDP, under Obama it has risen to 24 or 25% of GDP. We're going the way of the European countries and we're seeing what is happening there.

Love said...

SBVOR - The left or liberals haven't assulated our liberties in any way, shape or form.

It's the nutcase right that wants "big government " out of their lives, but feels it's just fine for "government" to be in our private lives and bedrooms.

Take the gun nuts: To this day they continue to act as if President Obama will be coming into their homes and taking their guns...yet...what is that based on? When was the last time he even mentioned guns or the 2nd Amendment in any speech or interview? (Nada)

The far right (and of course the Christian right) has corrputed the GOP and they'll pay for it in the next election.

If Reagan was running today, he couldn't beat Santorum.

Peano said...

Althorse said ... This post is meant to wake up Republicans who are making it too hard for me to stand near them.

As if Republicans want or need the likes of Althorse on their side.

This is called reverting to type. She's hippie to the heart, blonde to the bone, and politically correct to the top of her pointy academic head.

She's thrown her little snits about Zero and pretty much gotten that out of her system. Come November, she'll be his girl again. Watch and see.

chickelit said...

I Callahan said...
Love makes Jeremy look like a genius.

That's only because Love has half its brain tied behind its back. It can't too obviously show the full Jeremy.

SBVOR said...

Love stupidly & ignorantly claims:

“George W. Bush expanded government more than any previous President.”

1) Mandatory spending is -- by far -- the primary driver of deficit spending.

2) The overwhelming majority of mandatory spending was created by LBJ & his Dims when they signed Medicare & Medicaid into law.

3) Congress, not the President, is constitutionally responsible for ALL spending.

For details & substantiations, see:

http://sbvor.blogspot.com/2008/09/big-spending-dems.html

http://sbvor.blogspot.com/2010/02/deficit-spending-cause-cure-v20.html

Love said...

dreams - The biggest recession since the Great Depression began in December of 2007...a full 13 months BEFORE President Obama took office.

Without the stimulus we'd be in deep shit.

Anybody who reads already knows that...oh...and by the way: George W. Bush got things started with when he signed the 700 billion dollar bank bailout bill. (The deficit was at 10.7 trillion the day he walked)

Did you even know that?

I doubt it.

edutcher said...

Love said...

Maher is a comedian.

The fat man is a GOP leader...whether you admit it or not.


By Love's criteria, so is Maher who, if he's a comedian, he's kept it well-hidden for the last decade.

But so is that ad hoc diplomat, Sean Penn.

And then there's Babs Streisand, Joy Behar, Woofy Goldberg, Chris Rock, Ed Harris...

Gator McCluskey said...

wow, I have come across some Grade A trolls in my time, but this "Love/Jeremy" clown takes the cake. It is IMPERVIOUS to all logic and reason.

SBVOR said...

Love stupidly & ignorantly claims:

“The left or liberals haven't assaulted our liberties in any way, shape or form.”

Come on, love, let’s start with the obvious…

1) Are you seriously telling me the health care mandate is not an assault on our liberties? REALLY?

2) Are you seriously telling me the birth control coverage mandate is not an assault on our liberties? REALLY?

3) Are you seriously telling me the mandate that health insurance shall have no limits on the amount to be covered is not an assault on our liberties? REALLY?

Thanks to ObamaCare, what was previously a $6 million cap on my health insurance is now unlimited. In return for getting a “benefit” I never wanted, my health insurance premium went up 40% just within the last year.

THANKS, LOVE -- you damn little tyrant!

mccullough said...

Love,

Obama appointed Sotomayor and Kagan to the Supreme Court and they are anti gun rights. At least, that's how they voted in McDonald.

So those who think the government should not be able to prohibit law abiding adults from having a handgun in their homes should not vote for Obama.

smitty1e said...

For the record, co-ed is commonly used both in its original academic context and any other mixed-gender environment, e.g. "co-ed ships in the U.S. Navy".
RSM's use of the term in this context, far from derogatory, serves to underscore the fact that Fluke is by no means a simple student, but rather a propaganda tool.
Or are we missing the point that this is all ad hominem against Rush, with a side order of please-don't-look-at-that-tanked-economy?

rcommal said...

blonde to the bone

Well, no. She was (is?) a natural redhead. She once even vlogged about that--her sister was the blond; she herself was the redhead.

Now, as to NOW, maybe to the bone she's more like gray or white or a mix (I don't know and don't really care which). Regardless, she surely isn't *blond* "to the bone."

/OT. Carry on.

Hoosier Daddy said...

".. And the Democrats have successfully made giving free birth control to college students and employees of all businesses the main campaign issue. And made a winner for them..."

Well if the electorate is convinced 30 year old law students at elite colleges need free birth control then so be it.

It's not like this country was destined to survive forever.

damikesc said...

Whether you think Maher is funny is irrlevant.

You claim he's a comedian. Do YOU find calling Palin a c*nt to be funny?

How do you know what the fat man donates?

This is where you get off your butt and prove he donates more than a million. I doubt he donates close to that amount.

I can prove Maher gave Obama a million. He is FAR more important of a cog in the DNC than Rush, who openly loathes much of the Republican Party as is.

So you think the donations coming into the GOP coffers don't include those who call the President a Muslim or that he isn't an actual American citizen?

Can you prove that they do?

I can prove Obama took a million (at least) from a guy who uses quite vulgar terms for women he doesn't like.

...and which, mind you, you clearly support.

I don't like anybody calling woman such names, especially those who are an important part of the GOP party...which the fat man is.

Stop defending the fat man.


I can tell how much you dislike it --- given how much you criticize Maher for doing so...oh, wait.

The left or liberals haven't assulated our liberties in any way, shape or form.

Assuming you don't believe forcing somebody to buy insurance is an assault on liberty.

Or forcing religious groups to go against their beliefs in insurance options isn't one.

Or that CA really doesn't have a right to determine if they allow medical pot.

Or that Americans, no matter how vile, cannot be killed without some due process is not an assault on liberty.

Or if you believe that the PATRIOT Act's biggest problem is that it didn't go quite far enough.

It's the nutcase right that wants "big government " out of their lives, but feels it's just fine for "government" to be in our private lives and bedrooms.

Yes, saying "I don't want to pay for your contraceptives" is definitely interfering in bedroom activities.

She's thrown her little snits about Zero and pretty much gotten that out of her system. Come November, she'll be his girl again. Watch and see.

At this point, basically. She's going to vote for Obama and wants some defense for it --- since she can't point to policies that worked or anything he's done terribly well.

The biggest recession since the Great Depression began in December of 2007...a full 13 months BEFORE President Obama took office.

...but shortly after the Dems took over Congress. Odd, huh?

Anybody who reads already knows that...oh...and by the way: George W. Bush got things started with when he signed the 700 billion dollar bank bailout bill. (The deficit was at 10.7 trillion the day he walked)

Hey, didn't Obama and Biden have a chance to vote for it?

Remember how they voted?

Obama has yet to run a deficit of less than A TRILLION DOLLARS.

It's been 4 years. And while they hope not passing a budget excuses them, the Dems are criminal in their neglect.

Love said...

mccullough "College and law school are geared toward women. So you end up with Flukes."

Yeah...dem colleges have gots to GO!!!

Nuthin' but snobby women folk clutterin' up the campus...robbin' us men folks of our God given right!

They should be home...schoolin' da kid folk an' cookin' and other such stuff.

Love said...

Hoosier - "It's not like this country was destined to survive forever."

Based on the candidates you and your party are supporting that may be the case.

Love said...

smitty - "Or are we missing the point that this is all ad hominem against Rush, with a side order of please-don't-look-at-that-tanked-economy?"

Oh, is that poor, poor fat man being unjustly accused of being crude and digusting?

*The economy is actually picking up.

Maybe you should read more and spend less time defending cretins like fatso?

SBVOR said...

Love is too blind, too stupid and too ignorant to see that all of Western Civilization is rapidly collapsing under the weight of the very entitlement mentality which she never misses an opportunity to impose through force of law.

Homeboy #60 said...

Sorry Ann, didn't know you could ride a motorcycle. How do the sharks look while you're in mid-air? Deleting your blog from my bookmarks.

shiloh said...

"Based on the candidates you and your party are supporting that may be the case."

Love, to be fair, it's not their fault Paul/Newt/mittens/Santo is all they have to choose from lol.

And it could be worse :-P as Bachmann, the donald, Cain, Perry, Pawlenty dropped out.

It was somewhat amusing when "they" were hoping Christie/Jeb etc. was gonna ride in a teabagger horse and save the Rep party from themselves.

As mentioned last nite in another thread, Limbaugh was the keynote speaker at 2009 CPAC.

All aboard! :D

Dust Bunny Queen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
John Stodder said...

Freeman Hunt said: How about instead of coming out in automatic defense of a woman, we address the fact that this woman was twisting the truth for a political agenda?

She's hardly admirable.


My version would be: How about instead of attacking a woman, we address the fact that this woman was twisting the truth for a political agenda? Whether she's "admirable" or not is irrelevant. Her argument is fair game, but she isn't.

Hoosier Daddy said...

If birth control for 30 year old law students at elite colleges should be free why cant I get free food? Or at least a subsidy? How about a gas allowance?

Perhaps some of our liberal comrades should provide a list of things we should be entitled to receive for free? Cause I'm tired of having to pay for shit.

damikesc said...

Nuthin' but snobby women folk clutterin' up the campus...robbin' us men folks of our God given right!

Enrollment numbers similar to the present, but with the sexes reversed, were used to justify affirmative action for women.

Oh, is that poor, poor fat man being unjustly accused of being crude and digusting?

Maher isn't THAT fat. True, he's crude and disgusting --- but you like that.

He's a bad boy to you, huh?

As mentioned last nite in another thread, Limbaugh was the keynote speaker at 2009 CPAC.

Which I bet is run by the RNC...oh, wait.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

@ Love
(what a misnomer that is)

Chuck66 "Viagara is covered because it fixes a medical issue."

So do birth control pills.

It's a "fact."

1. Irregular menstrual periods
2. Benign breast disease
3. Pelvic inflammatory disease
4. Functional cysts
5. Ectopic pregnancies are prevented
6. Prevent certain ovarian and endometrial cancers

Other than that...

This issue is whether the Catholic Church should be forced to pay for items that are for CONTRACEPTION and ABORTIFACTANTS.....you know prevent children or kill children.

Something that is against the religious precepts of the church.


You might also try to at least be honest in that many Catholic organizations DO cover for all of those things you mentioned.

They WILL allow their plans (usually self funded by the way) to cover for the use of birth control pills for "pathological and medical" needs.

What they won't do and you and all the other nasty feminazi bitches want is for the Church to break it's religious vows so you can have free stuff.

The cost of birth control is cheap and often free.

It isn't about women's rights....because there IS NO RIGHT to force someone to pay for your recreational sex drugs or even your recreational dildos.

It is about Government control and about trying to destroy religion

garage mahal said...

Cause I'm tired of having to pay for shit.

Me too. Let's start a club!

Love said...

This is what a real leader sounds like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LD0ofsH44o&feature=player_embedded

Countering the politic bluster thrown around by those who have no real stake in the decision making or repurcussions.

damikesc said...

Her argument is fair game, but she isn't.

It apparently isn't because noting that condoms are no more covered than birth control pills is somehow anti-science or some such nonsense.

I agree with Hoosier --- tell us what should be free so we will at least know. Heck, to make it easier, what SHOULDN'T be "given" to people "for free"?

Frau said...

With their photographs alone, Althouse and Meade showed me the ugly behavior of Obama's faithful voters during the siege of Madison. Now, I find out she will vote again for the man about whom she later voiced regrets. WTH? I thought only mouth breathers were single-issue voters.

Love said...

Dust Bunny Queen "@ Love
(what a misnomer that is)"

Are you saying we can't be friends?

I'm crushed.

Absolutely...crushed.

As to: "This issue is whether the Catholic Church should be forced to pay for items that are for CONTRACEPTION and ABORTIFACTANTS.....you know prevent children or kill children."

Can I assume you haven't read or heard that the President has already altered his initial stand...not that the Catholic Church istself ever had to pay for any such contraceptives...that religious organization are no longer included, but the insurers are?

Why not read up on these things before posting right wing garbage that is not factual?

And if you're so concerned about unwanted children being born...why not get off your ass and adopt as many as you can?

You whine about government intrusion, while at the same time ask the government to tell a woman what she can or cannot do with her own body.

That's hypocritical and just plain dumb.

SBVOR said...

Love stupidly and ignorantly recommends the following clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LD0ofsH44o

Fortunately, Israel has a leader willing to do what's necessary to prevent the world's foremost sponsor of terrorism from acquiring the world's most dangerous weapons. Look for a surgical strike from Israel before the end of March.

If the world had to rely upon Obama and his naive faith in Iranian diplomacy, we would soon be seeing suitcase nukes in American cities.

mccullough said...

Love,

There's nothing wrong with college being largely populated by females and female professors debating ideas that women care about. Guys who want to partake in that should do so, on their own dime.

Guys have fantasy football. It's more fun and less expensive.

Santorum's a goof, but the point he was hopefully trying to make is that college is not and does not need to be a prerequisite to success in the U.S. There should be many options open to people. College and law school's cost to most students outweigh the benefits they will receive. So it's not worth their time and money. This is hardly a controversial position. Obama loves higher ed because it's a perfect forum for him. He really should have become a full-time law professor. He was a great law school instructor and would have enjoyed it. W. should have remained a baseball team owner for the same reason.

You should keep doing what you're doing as well, just keep paying for it yourself.

Alex said...

RSM is a nobody. Rush has already apologized, so the issue is over.

Love said...

Frau - Which one of the spectacular candidates in the GOP are you going to vote for?

Which one has shown you the ability to actually lead...opposed to spouting whatever he thinks is necessary to keep the "base" in line?

Right now we have all of them pushing for an invasion of Iran...you know, just in case.

Think that's a good idea?

Educate youself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LD0ofsH44o&feature=player_embedded

Alex said...

Where is the cruel neutrality on women's issues Ann?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Can I assume you haven't read or heard that the President has already altered his initial stand...not that the Catholic Church istself ever had to pay for any such contraceptives...that religious organization are no longer included, but the insurers are

Can I assume that you don't understand the term "self insured" which most religious organizations are?

Also can I assume that you are ignorant of basic econonmics?

By forcing the insurance comapanies (for those who don't self insure) to provide services for free, the cost of the premiums will just go up and cause a defacto purchasing of the verbottin products.

I am not friends with stupid people and you qualify in spades.

Love said...

Alex - The fat man never really "apologized."

He merely explained why he's being persocuted by the left.

To save sponsors...which is evidently not working out so well.

edutcher said...

Since Love wants to blather about advertisers Rush has lost, it may be pertinent to consider that the big national players who dropped him (Geico, Deere, Sears (sinking by the bow, anyway), Netflix) all dropped like stones in the market today.


People vote with their pocketbooks as well as their feet.

I Callahan said...

My version would be: How about instead of attacking a woman, we address the fact that this woman was twisting the truth for a political agenda? Whether she's "admirable" or not is irrelevant. Her argument is fair game, but she isn't

Right, play nice and get our asses kicked like we did with Dole, Bush Sr., Ford, McCain, etc.

Personally, I'm sick of it. The left smears and plays dirty for the past 60 years and we're the ones who get knocked by our own side. You certainly don't see the left doing this. Maybe that's why they've been able to move the ball to the left despite not having complete majorities the whole time.

You can feel good that you're above it all, John, but it doesn't do us any good anymore. It's time to stomp on their necks and call it the way it is.

The republican party isn't the stupid party, it's the milquetoast party.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

You whine about government intrusion, while at the same time ask the government to tell a woman what she can or cannot do with her own body.


A woman can do anything she wants with her body.

When you ask other people to pay for it.....that makes you just exactly what Rush said.

A slut and a whore.

dreams said...

The unemployment rate was 4.6 when the democrats took control of both houses of congress in Jan 2007. You can google it.

kimsch said...

@ Love

If mandating coverage (free as well) is so good Preventing pregnancy and your other list: 1. Irregular menstrual periods
2. Benign breast disease
3. Pelvic inflammatory disease
4. Functional cysts
5. Ectopic pregnancies are prevented
6. Prevent certain ovarian and endometrial cancers

hell, why not just mandate birth control period. Regardless of the personal convictions of women?

sakredkow said...

Althorse said ... This post is meant to wake up Republicans who are making it too hard for me to stand near them.

As if Republicans want or need the likes of Althorse on their side.

This is called reverting to type. She's hippie to the heart, blonde to the bone, and politically correct to the top of her pointy academic head.

She's thrown her little snits about Zero and pretty much gotten that out of her system. Come November, she'll be his girl again. Watch and see.


I love Republicans like this. I'm a Democrat, and I really love the Republicans who coarsen the discussion. You know, calling names and such.

It's not fair perhaps but it's easy to make it seem like most Republicans are like that, and that scares away the mods and the independents. Especially if someone like this has a lot of help.

Bring them out front and center. Let everyone in the marketplace here how these guys talk.

"This is your 2012 Republican Party"

Hoosier Daddy said...

Bambi should also mandate insurers provide coverage for breast augmentation, liposuction, and any cosmetic surgeries that will improve and low self esteem issues which is a cause of stress, which in turn is a serious health issue.

dreams said...

In what way are women prevented from doing whatever they want with bodies. They can take birth control, get abortions, whatever. Strawman argument.

Dante said...

$3000.00 or $200.00. If she wants to use her vagina, she should pay for it. Don't ask me to.

Love said...

Dust Bunny - There is no definitive evidence that insurance premiums will go up. That's just YOUR opinion.

Research the matter before posting silly comments. (http://www.factcheck.org/2012/02/cloudy-contraception-costs/)

And if you feel religious organizations should be so protected...shouldn't we disallow their being sheltered from paying taxes?

*The Obama administration announced in January that most employers will have to offer insurance that provides birth control to women with no copay or deductible.

The mandate applied to religiously affiliated organizations, such as hospitals and universities, but exempts religious entities, such as churches.

Obama amended the mandate in February to allow religious organizations to opt out of providing coverage that includes birth control, forcing the insurance companies to cover the costs of providing the contraception.

shiloh said...

"It is about Government control and about trying to destroy religion"

Since DBQ and crew are big on irrelevant deflections at this blog one must point out re: her Catholic church that perverted, sexually deviant, child molesting priests/bishops/cardinals have done a pretty good job destroying Catholicism ~ Obama, Fluke et al red herrings "they" can come up with notwithstanding.

Again, it's amazing how conservatives can get their panties in a bunch er all self-righteous about Obama and faux govt. control, at the same time ignoring Republican disenfranchise of older/minority voter rights.

Love said...

Hoosier - Remember this:

Bambi was in charge when our Seals killed Osama Bin Laden.

Bambi was also in charge when we killed about 25 of the top Taliban/Al Queda leads.

The guy YOU voted for...twice...talked the talk, but never actually walked the walk.

All he ever did was start the shit and leave it behind.

I Callahan said...

Obama amended the mandate in February to allow religious organizations to opt out of providing coverage that includes birth control, forcing the insurance companies to cover the costs of providing the contraception.

I'm going to keep saying it until it finally sinks in:

The employer pays the insurance companies. The insurance companies are mandated to cover birth control. Therefore, the employer pays for birth control.

I Callahan said...

her Catholic church that perverted, sexually deviant, child molesting priests/bishops/cardinals have done a pretty good job destroying Catholicism

There is a higher instance of this going on in public schools.

shiloh said...

Indeed, maybe the Catholic church should be a little more concerned w/child molesting priests and less concerned about birth control, 70 year old virgins who wear dresses notwithstanding.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Dust Bunny - There is no definitive evidence that insurance premiums will go up. That's just YOUR opinion

Thereby PROVING that Love is completely ignorant of economics and how businesses operate.

Hint. Businesses operate at a profit and if they are forced to give away free stuff.....the prices (aka premiums) will go up.

And I agree. Religious organizations and ALL non profits including Jessie Jackson, George Soro's puppets, ACORN etc...should pay some taxes.

Are you going to eliminate the charitable deduction...wait...as if you even understand what that is.

Sheesh.

Obama amended the mandate in February to allow religious organizations to opt out of providing coverage that includes birth control, forcing the insurance companies to cover the costs of providing the contraception.

Do you have even ONE clue about self insurance?

Nevermind. Self evident.

Love said...

shiloh - Oh, come on...you can't really think Dust Bunny gives a flying fuck about the "Catholic church that perverted, sexually deviant, child molesting priests/bishops/cardinals have done a pretty good job destroying Catholicism"...do you?

This is ALL about hating literally ANYTHING to do with Presient Obama.

She and others here just cannot get over the fact that he's running the show...and doing a good job of it to boot.

It's just driving them crazy.

I Callahan said...

And out come the anti-Catholic bigots.

Andy is the resident bigot expert; wonder where he is...

Hoosier Daddy said...

Democrats never use coarse language. That's why Ed Schultz changed parties when he called Inghram a slut.

I think Rush is an idiot for calling this chick a slut instead of a dependent wimp expecting free birth control when she's attending an elite college.

But I just chuckle at the faux outrage when liberal democrats are on record saying similar outrageous comments about conservative females.
That's why I just don't take you guys seriously.

garage mahal said...

FACT CHECK: There is no such thing as ACORN anymore. Carry on.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

I think Rush is an idiot for calling this chick a slut instead of a dependent wimp expecting free birth control when she's attending an elite college

Nope. Asking other people to pay for your ability to have unfettered sex, by definition puts you into the slut and whore category.

If you want sex, either just do it or don't but don't ask for people to pay you to do it.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Catholics would probably get more respect if they were predominately darker skinned and beheaded those that defiled the teachings of the Church.

Seems to work for that other 'religion'.

Love said...

Bunny - You really need to read something before posting.

Everything you just posted is nothing more than your own personal "opinion."

I'd be more than willing to stop all non-profits from avoiding having to pay taxes...as long as we throw the churches into the mix.

Who do you think will feel the heat more?

Now...don't answer yet...try thinking about it for a few minutes.

Churches...non-profits.

WHO takes in MORE $$$$$$$$$$$$$$???

WHO avoids more taxes???

Bender said...

Man these bigots are boring with the same old tedious hate.

Can't you come up with any new and exciting hate? Are you really that dull-witted?

shiloh said...

"And out come the anti-Catholic bigots."

I'm also Catholic and attend church. Parochial grade school, Jesuit high school, where I was taught not to keep my head in the sand.

take care

Love said...

Hoosier Daddy "Catholics would probably get more respect if they were predominately darker skinned and beheaded those that defiled the teachings of the Church."

I have no idea what the "darker skinned" comment means, other than you being some kind of racist prick...

...but why not get their take on why molesting children, and at the same time having the people at the very top...transferring and protecting those same abusers is less important than stopping women from getting contraceptives.

Get back to me on that.

damikesc said...

Can I assume you haven't read or heard that the President has already altered his initial stand

I was about to say "only a complete idiot can argue that and be serious", but then noticed who posted it and didn't bother.

Hint: A President saying "Well, then the insurer must make it free" is simply going to raise the costs for the policies elsewhere to cover it.

So they STILL have to provide it.

And if you're so concerned about unwanted children being born...why not get off your ass and adopt as many as you can?

Care to guess who runs most adoption agencies?

Hint: Not Progressives.

You whine about government intrusion, while at the same time ask the government to tell a woman what she can or cannot do with her own body.

Nobody cares what women do with their bodies.

Asking ME to pay for YOUR birth control, however, is the issue.

Try and keep up.

Right now we have all of them pushing for an invasion of Iran...you know, just in case.

Can you link to ALL of them suggesting an Iranian invasion? I'd love to see Ron Paul advocating that.

Heck, how about ANY of them?

Rick said...

"Elite" law schools, they call themselves.
"We are all so intelligent that it makes no sense to attempt to distinguish among us with this old-fashioned grading system, which means that law review membership should be voluntary and not tied to grades."
I lived this joke in the the 60s.

Bender said...

Here's a first -- DBQ, you're wrong on this one.

First, it seems to be born of a presumption, held by far too many people, that government is entitled to take whatever money it wants, such that the burden is on those who wish to keep their own property to justify keeping it. That is backwards.

It is not a question of being exempt from taxes, it is a question of what is the justification for imposing taxes in the first place?

Secondly, the revenue that any non-profit organization receives has already been taxed -- multiple times. Most recently by the person giving the money.

Thirdly, Leviathan needs to be stopped. It consumes far too much as it is.

Love said...

Bender - "Man these bigots are boring with the same old tedious hate."

To which "bigots" are you referring?

There are all kinds of bigots who post here on a daily basis.

damikesc said...

The guy YOU voted for...twice...talked the talk, but never actually walked the walk.

So Bush killed/captured ZERO Taliban/AQ leaders? That's your new argument today?

shiloh said...

Full disclosure:

I was not an Altar boy ;) but I was a pallbearer in the second grade.

Bender said...

I'm also Catholic and attend church.

And that is relevant how?

Some of the worst anti-Catholic bigots are members of the Catholic Church.

Alex said...

phx - I really love the Democrats who coarsen the discussion. You know like Bill Maher, Sandra Bernhard, Rev Wright and so on. Keep 'em coming!

Bender said...

To which bigots are you referring?

You really are dull-witted, Hate, aren't you?

Alex said...

Bender - how do you explain that kind of self-hatred?

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