March 2, 2012

"Obama Calls Student Attacked by Limbaugh in Birth-Control Debate."

Oh, my. Things have reached an advanced state of weirdness. I've been avoiding weighing in on this subject, in part because, as a law professor, I don't like talking about an individual law student. At this point, there's so much political leveraging going on, that I don't know where to begin. I'll make a list of my thoughts, numbered, but not in order of importance.

1. Everyone is using the birth control issue, seeking political advantage. I don't really care who started it, but all are responsible for exploiting it, and some are doing a better job of it than others.

2. The student, Sandra Fluke, is young, and she's gotten swept up into a media frenzy, but she's an adult, she's chosen to be a political activist, and she accepted a great opportunity, all voluntarily. I feel sympathetic toward someone who's got to deal with so much, so suddenly, but she seems to know what she's doing, and she's handling it well.

3. I like Rush Limbaugh, and I get his concept of media tweaking, and I get that he's lampooning government regulation, but this is one of his worst efforts. He's getting so much wrong. He keeps saying that the woman is asking taxpayers to pay for her birth control and that she wants it free. But she's talking about health insurance coverage, which is not paid for with tax money. She'd like government regulation requiring the private entities involved to cover birth control, but when our health insurance, which we pay for, covers something, we're not getting it free. We buy the health insurance! And Limbaugh keeps questioning how birth control could cost $1,000 a year. He calculates how many times the woman must be having sex, but obviously, the woman is talking about birth control pills (and perhaps other devices), which you use all the time, regardless of how often you have sex. And Limbaugh fails to include doctor visits in his calculations, and you need a prescription for birth control pills. So most of his humor — the woman must be having sex 3 times a day... she's a "slut" because she wants to be paid for having sex — is not based on facts. Limbaugh ended yesterday's segment with one of his refrains: He lives in "Realville." He needs to check his GPS. That was not from Realville.

4. Quite aside from the lack of a factual basis for his humor, it's just mean to aim words like "slut" and "prostitute" at a woman, especially a young woman, even if the metaphor is apt. Even when you get the joke and agree with the criticism of the policy she's advocating, it feels ugly. The humor backfires. 

5. I haven't listened to today's show yet, but I can see that he did a segment called "The Democrats are Desperate: Obama Calls Sandra Fluke, the 30-Year-Old Victim." I don't know. He's complaining that people "have no sense of humor" and that "all they've got, is to go out and try to discredit their critics, to impugn and discredit the people who disagree with them." That sounds desperate. Limbaugh is saying that he wants to be expansive and absurdist and have all his fun, but he's lavishly giving material to his political opponents, and they are going to have their fun too. Everyone's using everything, as I said, and the question is who's getting the best of it.

6. What's really at stake is the presidential election. Limbaugh is obtruding. Good for him. Nice for his show. But I don't think it's helping Romney and the not-Romneys.

360 comments:

«Oldest   ‹Older   201 – 360 of 360
Anonymous said...

Limbaugh should have at least considered the possibility that if Fluke was having a lot of sex, it may have been during the halcyon days of January, when contraceptives were so cheap that insurers could offer them at no charge and still come out ahead. Now that they're so expensive, she's probably cutting way back.

Lem the artificially intelligent said...

Girl nobody can make love all night long..

That's just a myth..

chickelit said...

36fsfiend asked: How about the contraceptives that are provided to our military service personnel courtesy of the taxpayer? Are those folks shameless as well?

Military people actually work for the federal government in one the few unquestioned role for the Federal Government. They deserve that benefit at least--yourself included IIRC. In a perfect world, all healthy people of every stripe might be more inclined to sacrifice.

Unlike military personel, Ms. Fluke is demanding an expansion of entitlements for herself. The media has portrayed her selfish gesture as a loving and deserving act on behalf of all women. That is shameless.

edutcher said...

One other point:

Too bad GodZero picked a Friday to pull this one.

Isn't Friday usually the day his evil minions dump some bad news on us all, so it will be lost in the weekend rush?

Especially considering Gallup is saying the BLS is gonna have some real bad news to lay on everybody real soon.

cubanbob said...

Hey Ed as long as we are required to subsidize her love life aren't we entitled to have her service us for the fees we paid? Otherwise we would be nothing more than indentured servants or slaves.

Haven't you heard, compadre?

That's Little Zero's goal for us all.

In the immortal words of Napoleon Solo, "He believes in the two party system. The Masters and The Slaves".

Anonymous said...

Looks like old Rush is doubling down:

http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201203020014

Again, I wonder why he isn't railing against the men who are supposedly having all the sex with this woman?

dreams said...

I don't think Sarah Palin likes being called names but liberals apparently think it's ok to call conservatives bad names.

John Stodder said...

Ugh all around. If I were Rick Santorum, I'd be throwing up.

The true absurdity here is the idea that we should pay money to an insurance company so they can reimburse us for buying birth control, which isn't very expensive to begin with.

Do people really think that passing our money around through our employer and their insurer, under the oversight of the government, and that, when it comes back to us "for free" that maybe we're really actually paying for it, indeed overpaying for it?

And yet, I'm this a women's issue.

Since this comment is approximately #205, I don't expect it to be read. But if you do get to this comment, somebody, anybody...Hi!

Ann Althouse said...

@Crack If Rush wants to be an edgy comedian, that's fine. But he can't easily turn around and push traditional values, which he also tries to do. He can't be the "big voice on the right" while indulging in that kind of comedy.

Comedy has consequences.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ann Althouse said...

Someone talked about how we need the next generation of human beings/workers to keep out system of social welfare afloat and then connected that to birth control. What will happen when we run out of young people?

But you want the right young people--productive citizens who create more resources than they consume. In that light, birth control is great. You prevent the birth of young citizens who would consume social welfare resources. Then, women will have children when they are ready, and these are the new citizens who will be a net benefit.

If you are afraid that women who can control the reproductive function will not produce any children, you should support incentives for childbirth, like tax exemptions. Plenty of able, competent women will produce and rear children if you set things up so that they want that.

But that's too liberal for most of you people. You want the old incentives: shaming, economic woe...

Anonymous said...

chickenlittle said...

“Military people actually work for the federal government in one the few unquestioned role for the Federal Government. They deserve that benefit at least--yourself included IIRC. In a perfect world, all healthy people of every stripe might be more inclined to sacrifice.

Unlike military personel, Ms. Fluke is demanding an expansion of entitlements for herself. The media has portrayed her selfish gesture as a loving and deserving act on behalf of all women. That is shameless.”

chickenlittle,

If using birth control helps improve the health and reduce medical costs for younger women, doesn’t that leave more resources for the sick people and the truly indigent that you are concerned about?

Darcy said...

Hi John Stodder. :)

And exactly. Someone said upthread that nothing is "free".

This is all about "free" "healthcare" for all. Because it sounds so nice! Doesn't it? ;-)

Almost Ali said...

Anyway, I much prefer Rush's version - especially since it encapsulates the driving force behind the women's movement, namely the pill.

However, there's been an assumption that Ms. Fluke is heterosexual, so next time she appears in front of the camera, she should present partners as sworn witnesses.

MayBee said...

In that light, birth control is great. You prevent the birth of young citizens who would consume social welfare resources.

And yet, with all the abundant birth control in our country, these young unproductive citizens keep being born.

Are we assuming people who have jobs at Catholic Hospitals and are students at Catholic Universities raise the worst kids in America? Is there a higher rate of unwanted pregnancy/welfare children among these people than in the general population?

Because MedicAid already provides birth control coverage.

Geoff Matthews said...

Here's how I would handle it.


Birth control is a personal decision, best left to individuals to handle. Given the increasing costs for health insurance, I do not support another burden for insurance plans, which will only increase the costs of a service that has been getting more expensive.


And that's it.

MayBee said...

birth control is great.

Plus, this makes it sound like you really believe someone out there wants to ban birth control or reduce access.

So, no wonder you didn't take issue with Obama campaign's fear mongering yesterday.

Anonymous said...

"Canuck- you are getting sidetracked. Most plans that have prescription coverage would treat the pill (or another medicine) used for that purpose like any other prescription. Even so, not all insurance has prescription coverage."

The GOP is getting sidetracked, apparently by Rush Limbaugh.

I'm letting you know how a lot of women will see this issue. Many college age students are on it for PMS, cramps and acne. Many of their mothers will not appreciate the implication that their daughters are sluts simply because they take the pill for medical reasons.

Obama is the luckiest politician ever.

chickelit said...

@36fsfiend: You either didn't read or ignored my earlier comment on that point so I will repeat it here for you:

The problem with that argument is that preventive healthcare is an expense on top of fast growing acute and elder care. The rationale is that such care will prevent future outlays. This is not going to square well with current demographic trends. Young, healthy people like the insistent Ms. Fluke are actually taking resources away from sick people and the truly indigent. In a sense, Ms. Fluke should be ashamed that she is not "paying forward."

But, more importantly--she votes--democratic.


Yes, preventive healthcare will save money in the future. But the healthcare reality is quite different. We owe enormous unfunded liabilities to people who have no need for birth control. Obama knows this. What's he's doing is--and Althouse herself has argued this herself I believe--is getting younger people to sign onto to his program by giving them a perk. He wants their votes. He's not telling them that he's going to be taking away a much greater part of their income in the future as a consequence.

The lie here is that the governement can somehow deliver subsidy for birth control more efficiently than people can acquire it themselves. The money has to come from somewhere eventually fiend--where do you propose it comes from?--oh yeah--I forgot--the rich. Tax the rich until there are no more rich.

I think the "politically correct" attitude for somelike Fluke to have would be "My asking for more will take something away for someone of lesser means."
__________
BTW, I dislike commenting in these over 200 threads, so by for now.

Anonymous said...

Ann Althouse said...

"If you are afraid that women who can control the reproductive function will not produce any children, you should support incentives for childbirth, like tax exemptions. Plenty of able, competent women will produce and rear children if you set things up so that they want that."

Sounds like a plug for universal healthcare.

MayBee said...

Many of their mothers will not appreciate the implication that their daughters are sluts simply because they take the pill for medical reasons

You know what implication I don't appreciate?
The implication that women can't think through complex issues. Our pretty little heads just hear "birth control pill" and "slut" and we just get the vapors!

Almost Ali said...

Many college age students are on it for PMS, cramps and acne.

Exclusively?

edutcher said...

Canuck said...

Obama is the luckiest politician ever.

Until gas hits 5+ a gallon and the U3 and inflation both go double digits.

All he'll need after that is a Middle East crisis.

Y'know that 3am phone call.

The one that can't be fixed by a drone strike or a SEAL Team raid.

chickelit said...

@36fsfiend: Imagine the demographic bulge in the proverbial snake travelling through its body. That snake is about to begin taking a massive dump: those people will have no need of birth control. We may likely need more people to support the costs of that demographic bulge about to reach end-of-life care.

Saint Croix said...

I can see this law student and Buffett's secretary following Obama around on tour.

Mo Money and The Pill.

"I need mo money!"

"I need the pill!"

On the chorus they cry in unison.

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...
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Bender said...

But you want the right young people--productive citizens who create more resources than they consume. In that light, birth control is great. You prevent the birth of young citizens who would consume social welfare resources.

Ah, the social-darwinist, eugenic argument raises it ugly racist head -- we need to have only the "right" kind of people reproducing, and stop the breeding of the "wrong" kind of people, not merely the "three generations of idiots," but the socio-economic drags on society, the useless welfare consumers (wink, wink, nudge, nudge, know who I mean?).

edutcher said...

36fsfiend said...

If you are afraid that women who can control the reproductive function will not produce any children, you should support incentives for childbirth, like tax exemptions. Plenty of able, competent women will produce and rear children if you set things up so that they want that.

Sounds like a plug for universal healthcare.


No, more like the MutterKreuz and the Lebensborn.

Anonymous said...

chickenlittle,

Yes, we do owe enormous unfunded liabilities to people who have no need for birth control. And part of that problem is the estimated $60 to $90 billion in Medicare fraud by providers that occurs each year. The DoJ was able to claw back a little over $4 billion last year which was a record high.

I don’t think Obama is trying to buy votes, he’s trying to improve the system. Again, contraception helps women better avoid unwanted pregnancies, preventing abortions, and allows them to space their pregnancies to promote optimal birth outcomes.

As far as taxes, I do agree that the tax code needs to be revised. Something’s wrong when I’m paying a higher overall rate than Romney. Let’s close up some of the loop holes and cut out some of the give always.

Anonymous said...

edutcher said...

“36fsfiend said...

If you are afraid that women who can control the reproductive function will not produce any children, you should support incentives for childbirth, like tax exemptions. Plenty of able, competent women will produce and rear children if you set things up so that they want that.

Sounds like a plug for universal healthcare.

No, more like the MutterKreuz and the Lebensborn.”

edutcher,

The initial quote was from Ann.

Michael said...

Everybody should apologize to everybody else once and for all. All day yesterday lefties were asserting their right to make truth to power tough statements about the bad Breibart. Today the same lefties are back on the civility bit in a huff about the poor little 30 year old who stupidly wants to defend something she cant quite articulate. And now ew all should apologize.

sakredkow said...

And what's truly funny is how the media goes into PC bullshit alarm mode.

What's truly funny is how the Republicans are going to get beat so badly in November. They just aren't mature enough to handle a Presidential election anymore.

Doesn't matter to me. I'm sorry for the grownups in the GOP.

Saint Croix said...

working on a blues song...

"Oh I need three thousand condoms.
Cause they keep poppin'.
I say I need three thousand condoms right now, boy.
Cause they keep poppin'.

I got a contraception emergency.

Come on, Georgetown Law School.
Don't you have some condoms for me?

Come on, Congress!

I need some condoms.
I say I need some rubbers.
I need some free damn prophylactics.

I need three thousand condoms for all the sweet lovin' I give to the world.

And don't call me names or I will sue.
I say I will sue.
Cause that's what I'm training to do.
Sue, sue, sue. Sue, sue, sue.
And I need some condoms from you.

Three thousand sweet condoms from you.

Hey, Uncle Sam. Make love, not war. And I need condoms. Lots and lots of condoms.

I need free condoms from youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu."

work in progress

Michelle Dulak Thomson said...

Canuck,

Interesting. Would people pay for painful period cramps or is that slutty mcslut slut slut behaviour too? Is it really any of your never mind what is happening during a woman's period? Do you want to hear about PMS symptoms and heavy periods? Seriously?

Don't any of you have daughters who take the pill for period cramps and PMS symptoms?


Hmm. I had painful menstrual cramps for a couple of decades. I spent a number of hours in high school (on many occasions) in the nurse's office in a darkened room, being kept comfortable and treated with ... aspirin.

Yep, you can actually do that. Pain-killers kill pain. Who knew?

My experience of contraceptives is limited to condoms. Which, from all the talk of thousands of dollars a year for birth control, some people don't seem to think exist.

somefeller said...

The initial quote was from Ann.

In the immortal words of that greatest of American conservatives, Rick Perry, oops.

traditionalguy said...

What we need here is an earmark.

It is obvious that the GOP Tampa Convention will need several million dollars in emergency contraceptives when the calendar doesn't fit the Rhythm method used by the innocent GOP wives. That in turn could cause the horny delegates to turn to the Army of Whores that comes into town for every Convention.

It's the MEN who want and need their women to be on contraceptives. Accusing women of liking sex too much is horribly against Men's interests. And the happily cooperative women will never forgive this betrayal of them by a few idiots.

The dems were already in a feeding frenzy over the GOP's blood in the water over contraceptives.

Then Rush jumped so far over the shark and that he has come down among the Media Great Whites with Jaws wide open.

somefeller said...

Today the same lefties are back on the civility bit in a huff about the poor little 30 year old who stupidly wants to defend something she cant quite articulate.

Actually, she articulated her position quite well, including the part about her classmate who needed birth control medication to control ovarian cyst. It's the imbeciles who support Rush Limbaugh's comments that are sputtering and babbling. But that's no surprise.

Rusty said...

But y'all have fun alienating American women and calling them sluts.



How about just the slutty ones.


2.74 times a day. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say she has more than one boyfriend.

somefeller said...

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say she has more than one boyfriend.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you are a complete moron. And we both may be right. The problem is, even if that's the case, you'll still be a moron.

edutcher said...

36fsfiend said...

edutcher,

The initial quote was from Ann.


So? Fiend wants the statement to be used to justify ZeroCare.

If ZeroCare wants to get in the business of making sure there are enough drones produced, that's where it's gonna lead.

Michelle Dulak Thomson said...

[Trying again; I can't see my post now.]

Canuck,

Interesting. Would people pay for painful period cramps or is that slutty mcslut slut slut behaviour too? Is it really any of your never mind what is happening during a woman's period? Do you want to hear about PMS symptoms and heavy periods? Seriously?

Don't any of you have daughters who take the pill for period cramps and PMS symptoms?


Hmm. I had painful menstrual cramps for a couple of decades. I spent a number of hours in high school (on many occasions) in the nurse's office in a darkened room, being kept comfortable and treated with ... aspirin.

Yep, you can actually do that. Pain-killers kill pain. Who knew?

My experience of contraceptives is limited to condoms. Which, from all the talk of thousands of dollars a year for birth control, some people don't seem to think exist.

wv: stsibume fgheryth

Anonymous said...

edutcher said...

“So? Fiend wants the statement to be used to justify ZeroCare.”

No. the ACA, or ZeroCare as you call it, is not universal healthcare.

“If ZeroCare wants to get in the business of making sure there are enough drones produced, that's where it's gonna lead.”

What do you mean by drones?

Rose said...

She mentions attending school on her 'scholarship' implying that she got a full ride... is that the case? If so, what is that worth?

And what SHOULD she have to pay for? If not her schooling (as my kids do), if not her "contraception" (as my kids do, as I do, as everyone else I know does)...

Is her housing provided free also? in other words, to what extent is this twit milking the system?

Must be nice - having everything paid for - and not having a grateful bone in your body. Filthy little bitch, for crying out loud.

Again, this is a set-up - a new-age con-job pulled off by the Soros/Obama kabal.

And every aspect of her life needs to be looked at to reveal EXACTLY what the real story is - what qualifies her to speak before Congress, has she eaened one iota of respect (other than from Obama, who obviously KNOWS she is working for him, and feels bad that he got her into this mess.)

somefeller said...

...and Rose comes along to help support my comment about "imbeciles who support Rush Limbaugh's comments that are sputtering and babbling". And as stated, no surprise.

Anonymous said...

somefeller said...

"...and Rose comes along to help support my comment about "imbeciles who support Rush Limbaugh's comments that are sputtering and babbling". And as stated, no surprise."

somefeller,

And it looks like he is in trouble with his sponsors:

http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/02/10562744-rush-limbaugh-in-hot-water-with-sponsors-after-slut-remark

So much for the name "Exceptional Broadcasting" I guess.

sakredkow said...

Whoever the Republican candidate is the Dems just tied him to Rush Limbaugh.

damikesc said...

That *that* isn't as outrageous as whatever Rush said is just baffling to me.

It's OK when Democrats do it.

Don't any of you have daughters who take the pill for period cramps and PMS symptoms?

Did they have their daughters testify to Congress that they should have the pills paid for by others?

I wonder if any of Limbaugh's four wives have ever used birth control pills? If so, does that mean they are "sluts" as well?

Did they ask the government to pay for their BC pills?

If not, then how is this an even remotely germane comparison?

PeterK said...

from JWF
http://www.jammiewf.com/2012/sandra-flukes-appearance-is-no-fluke/

and from Get Religion
www.getreligion.org/2012/03/expert-witness-or-fluke/?

2 very interesting blog posts about the whole debacle

Jason said...

And it looks like he is in trouble with his sponsors

Please. Rush Limbaugh has more listeners in one day than many TV stations get total viewers in an entire week. If a sponsor is foolish enough to leave his show, there will be plenty more waiting in the wings. In election season, there is no more entertaining talk show than Limbaugh's.

Limbaugh may have had a poor choice in words, but if you want true vitriol, just watch Bill Maher's show on HBO or listen to Mike Malloy on the radio. Then you will know what true hate and craziness is.

Anonymous said...

phx said...

"Whoever the Republican candidate is the Dems just tied him to Rush Limbaugh."

Oh, yeah.

Renee said...

One of the nice things about courts, is that we won't have to deal with this BS.

Again, I'm Catholic I take the practice of NFP quite seriously on a religious, health, and scientific basis.

I don't like it when liberals mock NFP as unreliable or having numerous children as dangerous, and I don't like it when conservative pundits using it to their financial benefit of getting their fan base all riled up.

Milwaukee said...

This woman deserves none of our sympathy. She purposefully enrolled at this University to make an issue of that institution not offering contraceptives. She is a woman's rights activist. Didn't know such women were so sexually active. Figures, how else do they attract men to their cause?

What is it with leftist that they feel the need to barge in on someone else's gig and feel the need to tell other people how to run their lives?

Ann: you might strike some chords to bring in conservative comments, but you're a member of the elitist bunch, just a contraran member. Conservative, you're not.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

“Please. Rush Limbaugh has more listeners in one day than many TV stations get total viewers in an entire week. If a sponsor is foolish enough to leave his show, there will be plenty more waiting in the wings. In election season, there is no more entertaining talk show than Limbaugh's.

Limbaugh may have had a poor choice in words, but if you want true vitriol, just watch Bill Maher's show on HBO or listen to Mike Malloy on the radio. Then you will know what true hate and craziness is.”

Jason,

Well, he’s lost three so far.

Why would some reputable business want to associate with a public figure who calls a private citizen and woman a “slut” on national radio?

Ms. Fluke is not a politician or public official. Does Bill Maher or Mike Malloy go after private citizens?

damikesc said...

Again, I wonder why he isn't railing against the men who are supposedly having all the sex with this woman?

Are the men demanding Congress to pay for their BC pills?

If not, how is this even a remotely germane comparison?

If using birth control helps improve the health and reduce medical costs for younger women, doesn’t that leave more resources for the sick people and the truly indigent that you are concerned about?

If true --- they'd be free right now. You would not have to force anybody to cover something if it was actually cheaper to do so.

I'm letting you know how a lot of women will see this issue. Many college age students are on it for PMS, cramps and acne. Many of their mothers will not appreciate the implication that their daughters are sluts simply because they take the pill for medical reasons.

Do their daughters testify before Congress that others should foot the bill for it?

I'll note that I'm asking the same question a lot since the exact same weak arguments are being made.

I don’t think Obama is trying to buy votes, he’s trying to improve the system

Another rube self-identifies.

Something’s wrong when I’m paying a higher overall rate than Romney.

Arguable. Perhaps if you could do math, we can talk. As it is, you clearly cannot do math so it is immaterial.

Actually, she articulated her position quite well, including the part about her classmate who needed birth control medication to control ovarian cyst.

No concerns that 3 of the 4 policies covered it just fine? Or is lying just expected?

damikesc said...

Does Bill Maher or Mike Malloy go after private citizens?

Routinely.

Jason said...

Well, he’s lost three so far.

Like I said, he wont have any trouble finding more. Sponsors buy time on the radio, and there is no other radio show in America listened to more than Limbaugh's.

Ms. Fluke is not a politician or public official. Does Bill Maher or Mike Malloy go after private citizens?

Yes. On a daily basis - or in Maher's case, every Friday. Simply watch his show starting at 9 PM tonight.

I didnt see this sort of shock and outrage from the left when Maher called Sarah Palin a "cunt" last year, or the countless times he called George W Bush things like a "dumb fuck".

Goju said...

So let me get this straight; Rush calls this girl a slut and it is of such national importance that Obama makes a - highly publicized -phone call to reassure her. But when a US Border Patrol Agent is murdered by drug cartel thugs using guns given to them by this admisistration, Obama still hasn'tfound the time to send so much as a post card.

Rose said...

If this were at truly honest discussion, it would not be about "contraception' (code word for abortion anyway, admit it).

If it TRULY were about women's health, it would be about breast cancer meds, hysterectomies, hormone therapy and the like.

"Contraception" is merely a constrcut and it is mind-boggling that everyone is falling into the meme.

The only time the left cares about "health" is when it gets them something they want, like POT and now, what is it? Condoms? the Pill? IUDs? The patch? Abortion on demand? Morning after pills?

No - this is just about pitting people against each other, keeping the polarization and demonization going, and little 30-something Miss Fluke is probably being paid.

And, no, if she were my daughter, I would NOT be PROUD of her not bing able to provide for herself at the age of 30, or not having chosen a life partner who was strong enough and driven enough and successful enough to at least be able to afford birth control.

If they can't afford that - what kind of life are they going to have? A life of dependency and poverty. Not what her fancy education is supposed to result in.

She'll be a bag-lady in less than 20 years at this rate.

ed said...

"You can't call women sluts no matter what they do now and to do so implies an attempt to control their behavior ..." - Kirby Olson

Well that's interesting.

Sarah Palin got called a "whore" and there wasn't much handwringing by the left. Or at all.

Bristol Palin was called a slut by Letterman and there wasn't 1/10th the anger by the media.

So I'm not really all that impressed by this.

Goju said...

So let me get this straight; Rush calls this girl a slut and it is of such national importance that Obama makes a - highly publicized -phone call to reassure her. But when a US Border Patrol Agent is murdered by drug cartel thugs using guns given to them by this admisistration, Obama still hasn'tfound the time to send so much as a post card.

Alex said...

This is typical Limpballs being a pig.

Bruce Hayden said...

As I said over in that thread at volokh.com, Rush utilized reductio ad absurdum. The woman was asking that the rest of her insurance pool pay for her non-procreative sex. Paying you for sex is prostitution. As pointed out above, at this point, we are just quibbling about price.

The analogy or whatever though isn't completely accurate, because those paying aren't getting the benefit of their payments, as would typically be the case with prostitution. And, those paying are more like the "Johns" than the pimps.

But, bottom line, she was testifying that the rest of us should be paying for her recreation sex.

BTW - don't know what is wrong, but can't get comments any more over 200.

Alex said...

Bristol Palin was called a slut by Letterman and there wasn't 1/10th the anger by the media.

Because the Palin's are the butt of all jokes. Ms. Fluke is a respectable Georgetown law student. Bow down dittohead.

edutcher said...

36fsfiend said...

So? Fiend wants the statement to be used to justify ZeroCare.

No. the ACA, or ZeroCare as you call it, is not universal healthcare.


Yet.

But that's the ultimate intent.

Single payer.

somefeller said...

Rose raves:She'll be a bag-lady in less than 20 years at this rate.

I doubt she'll join you, Rose. She's a student at Georgetown Law School, which means she's already accomplished by the age of 30 more than you will ever accomplish in your life. She'll come out of this just fine.

Alex said...

The sooner Limpballs disappears form the national scene the better. Isn't 24 years enough? I swear he said this crap just because he secretly wants OUT of this gig already. No other reasonable explanation.

Anonymous said...

damikesc said...

“Are the men demanding Congress to pay for their BC pills?”

Are vasectomies and erectile dysfunction medications covered by insurance? I’m pretty sure they are.

“If not, how is this even a remotely germane comparison?”

It’s germane because like the old saying goes, it takes two to tango. Why are only the women being held accountable for the sex?

“If true --- they'd be free right now. You would not have to force anybody to cover something if it was actually cheaper to do so.”

Do you mean drug companies would just manufacture BC drugs for free? Interesting.

“Another rube self-identifies.”

Well, Limbaugh is doing a good job to push women to vote for Obama, so who is really the rube?

“Arguable. Perhaps if you could do math, we can talk. As it is, you clearly cannot do math so it is immaterial.”

That’s pretty ignorant since you have no awareness on my tax situation. But, I guess that should be expected.

Alex said...

somefeller... the Limp-bots are just saying their programmed talking points for today. They thrash about in impotent rage at a world they don't understand and that has passed them by.

Jason said...

She's a student at Georgetown Law School, which means she's already accomplished by the age of 30 more than you will ever accomplish in your life. She'll come out of this just fine.

GW Bush went to Yale, but I thought he was one of the stupidest people on the planet?!?!?

I love how education matters unless you are a conservative.

A degree is a piece of paper that means nothing. Some of the smartest, most successful people I know dont have one.

Anonymous said...

damikesc said...

"Does Bill Maher or Mike Malloy go after private citizens?

Routinely."

I don't watch these programs. Do you have a link to a segment where he goes after a private citizen?

ed said...

"Because the Palin's are the butt of all jokes. Ms. Fluke is a respectable Georgetown law student. Bow down dittohead." - Alex

Ahh yes the libtard definition of "civility".

Here's a clue for you: Not a lot of people are buying your bullshit.

Oh sure you libtards are huffing and puffing about this crap. But people don't like mandates. And they especially don't like having their First Amendment rights screwed with. Tag that with the distrust and disdain that Americans have for the media, the media that you asshats rely on so much for your memes.

You're all blow and no job.

wv: epube. rather appropriate for Alex.

Alex said...

Guess what, Rush is the news and he can try to talk about anything else but it won't work. The Senate Democrats have already raised $1.1 million for a petition to get Limbaugh fired. Boehner is under fire to throw Rush under the bus. Obama called Rush out today. Rush has to fall on his sword to end this.

Alex said...

Guess what Repukes - alienating 50% of the voters doesn't win elections.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

"Like I said, he wont have any trouble finding more. Sponsors buy time on the radio, and there is no other radio show in America listened to more than Limbaugh's."

I guess that says something about the people who listen to his program, doesn't it?

"Yes. On a daily basis - or in Maher's case, every Friday. Simply watch his show starting at 9 PM tonight."

I don't watch these programs. Do you happen to have a link to a segment where goes after a specific private citizen by name?

"I didn't see this sort of shock and outrage from the left when Maher called Sarah Palin a "cunt" last year, or the countless times he called George W Bush things like a "dumb fuck"."

I personally do not agree with that type of language, but in those cases are not Palin and Bush public figures? They're not private citizens, correct?

Jason said...

I don't watch these programs. Do you have a link to a segment where he goes after a private citizen?

Simply google "Bill Maher", "Sarah Palin", and "cunt". You will get over 300,000 links to choose from. You could probably find links that show Maher calling Palin a "dumb twat" too.

Palin isnt any less of a private citizen as Ms. Fluke, as she hasnt held a public office in 4 years. Yet she has been lambasted, ridiculed and degraded more than any other woman in this country during that time period.

Anonymous said...

edutcher said...

"But that's the ultimate intent.

Single payer."

I don't know if that is the plan, is it?

Also, again, what did you mean by creating drones?

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

"Simply google "Bill Maher", "Sarah Palin", and "cunt". You will get over 300,000 links to choose from. You could probably find links that show Maher calling Palin a "dumb twat" too."

So you actually don't have an example of Maher criticizing a private citizen by name?

"Palin isnt any less of a private citizen as Ms. Fluke, as she hasnt held a public office in 4 years. Yet she has been lambasted, ridiculed and degraded more than any other woman in this country during that time period."

Palin is most certainly a public figure as a former governor, current Fox News commentator and TV celebrity. She's constantly in the media.

Jason said...

Palin is most certainly a public figure as a former governor, current Fox News commentator and TV celebrity. She's constantly in the media.

I get it. So that makes it OK then.

Its just amazing the double standard that exists.

edutcher said...

somefeller said...

Rose raves:She'll be a bag-lady in less than 20 years at this rate.

I doubt she'll join you, Rose. She's a student at Georgetown Law School, which means she's already accomplished by the age of 30 more than you will ever accomplish in your life. She'll come out of this just fine.


What's the flame-out rate on lawyers these days?

If the job doesn't get her, the lifestyle and the attitude will.

Michael said...

A millionbillion years ago it seems we were told there were 12 million people who were unisured in this country. That paltry problem was solved so we can move on to free drugs for Georgetown law students. We are a very stupid people with very weak leaders. At least the people are no longer dying in the streets like before.

ed said...

"Guess what, Rush is the news and he can try to talk about anything else but it won't work. The Senate Democrats have already raised $1.1 million for a petition to get Limbaugh fired. Boehner is under fire to throw Rush under the bus. Obama called Rush out today. Rush has to fall on his sword to end this." - Alex

**LAUGH**

1. Rush Limbaugh -loves- being in the news. It gets him ratings.

2. Oh yeah right. Senate Democrats are going to get Rush Limbaugh fired. Sure. Good luck with that.

3. Boehner is going to throw Rush Limbaugh "under the bus".

O.o

And how precisely is that supposed to happen? Limbaugh is a private citizen and Boehner has no authority whatsoever over him. Arguably Rush Limbaugh has more power than Boehner does.

4. So. Obama called out Rush Limbaugh. Yeah nobody cares. Obama could call out for a pizza and the only difference between the two is $20. Importance? Zero.

5. End this? Rush Limbaugh is probably going to keep pushing it.

You lefties really overestimate your importance. The reality is that you are really just nothing much more than a minor irritation.

But what will be amusing is when conservatives start dragging out the vicious words you folks have been using over the past few years against conservative and Republican women. In the light of this fake outrage you'll have to defend the nonsense you've been sputtering.

And that will require some popcorn.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

"I get it. So that makes it OK then.

Its just amazing the double standard that exists."

No. As I stated previously, I don't agree with that type of language against private or public figures.

I was simply countering your comment that Palin is a private person by pointing out that she actually is a public figure as a former governor, current Fox News commentator and TV celebrity and that she's constantly in the media.

Almost Ali said...

Meanwhile, Mr. Obama continues to work the 19th Amendment for all it's worth.

Jason said...

I was simply countering your comment that Palin is a private person by pointing out that she actually is a public figure as a former governor, current Fox News commentator and TV celebrity and that she's constantly in the media.

That's all well and good. But after Maher called Palin a "cunt", I didnt see the President of the United States make a phone call to Sarah Palin and use her as a political prop, which is what Obama did today with Ms. Fluke.

Ms. Fluke has allowed herself to be used in this way for her own personal benefit. After her testimony to congress, she's been on TV non-stop. She is now the defacto leader of this contraceptive fight.

So, like I said, she is no longer a private person any more or less than Palin.

I dont condone Limbaugh's comments either, and I believe they were a poor choice of words. That being said, conservative women have been talked about in this way for years by lefty pundits, with nary a peep from the left and mainstream media. But the minute a conservative makes a comment like this, whether its Limbaugh, Levin, or someone else, its front page news.

I personally cannot believe that the discussion over this garbage (meaning contraception) has reached the heights it has in a country where 1 in 10 people are out of work and the economy is on the brink. The fact that the left wants to make THIS an issue is just appalling.

edutcher said...

36fsfiend said...

But that's the ultimate intent.

Single payer.


I don't know if that is the plan, is it?


Of course he does.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

“That's all well and good. But after Maher called Palin a "cunt", I didnt see the President of the United States make a phone call to Sarah Palin and use her as a political prop, which is what Obama did today with Ms. Fluke.”

Well, I guess since Palin is a former governor and a wealthy public figure with a large following, the President may have figured that she could hold her own against a comedian as opposed to Ms. Fluke who is a private person under siege by a nationally know multimillionaire. That almost seems like thugary doesn’t it?

“Ms. Fluke has allowed herself to be used in this way for her own personal benefit. After her testimony to congress, she's been on TV non-stop. She is now the defacto leader of this contraceptive fight.”

She is the defacto leader of this contraceptive fight because of the attacks from Limbaugh. I have to wonder if he is not secretly trying to make her rich.

“So, like I said, she is no longer a private person any more or less than Palin.”

She’s not close to being a public figure like Palin.

“I dont condone Limbaugh's comments either, and I believe they were a poor choice of words. That being said, conservative women have been talked about in this way for years by lefty pundits, with nary a peep from the left and mainstream media. But the minute a conservative makes a comment like this, whether its Limbaugh, Levin, or someone else, its front page news.”

I’m glad that you don’t agree with the comments as well. Women on the left are attacked as well. For example, do you recall the time Glen Beck pretended to poison Pelosi on his show?

“I personally cannot believe that the discussion over this garbage (meaning contraception) has reached the heights it has in a country where 1 in 10 people are out of work and the economy is on the brink. The fact that the left wants to make THIS an issue is just appalling.”

Jason, I agree there are more important issues that need to be addressed. But, recall which party is fighting against contraception. And why is that the case?

Anonymous said...

edutcher,

What about creating drones? What did you mean by that?

Jane the Actuary said...

This is the insurance policy in question.

http://studentaffairs.georgetown.edu/insurance/premierplanbooklet.pdf#page=32

Note that
1) this is not subsidized by the university (wouldn't make much sense to do so, would it?) but is just a group-rates policy required for any student who doesn't have other coverage.

2) The rates are fairly low because of the expectation that routine healthcare is provided at the on-campus clinic.

3) Because the rates are so low, and it's a fairly homogeneous population, a demand that contraception be included is basically asking her non-contracepting fellow students to subsidize those who use it, and condom users to subsidize, say, implant users.

4) Even if contraception were covered, the $10/$25/$45 copays would probably mean it's a wash anyway, unless you're determined to use the priciest type.

5) "Medically necessary" contraception (that is, pills used for other purposes) would appear to be covered under the general "medically necessary" clause. But I googled PCOS (and "PCOS Catholic") and it pretty much looks like BCP is the default, but by no means the only treatment.

6) All that being said, ultimately, the only potential benefit I can imagine is that if Georgetown included the cost of free pills in tuition, she could apply financial aid and student loans to the cost. Although -- can't you do that anyway -- that is, isn't there an amount added to tuition to cover general living expenses anyway?

Alex said...

Looks like anal cyst Limbaugh is on his last legs here. Should be fun to watch him publicly grovel for forgiveness from the law student who can't keep her legs shut.

Alex said...

One thing I'll have to take issue with my leftist friends is that Ms. Fluke is def not a private citizen anymore. Had she been content to only do the Congressional hearing and NOT appear on all the TV shows I'd have cut her some slack, but she's clearly an activist and thus FAIR game. She should really learn the virtues of aspirin.

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

"One thing I'll have to take issue with my leftist friends is that Ms. Fluke is def not a private citizen anymore. Had she been content to only do the Congressional hearing and NOT appear on all the TV shows I'd have cut her some slack, but she's clearly an activist and thus FAIR game. She should really learn the virtues of aspirin."

Alex,

If Ms. Fluke had been allowed to testify during Issa's hearing, do you think there would have been this much commotion?

This is a women's issue and women should have been permitted to participate in that hearing.

Alex said...

This is a women's issue and women should have been permitted to participate in that hearing.

Translation - you want the government to intrude in favor of some special interest group(promiscuous young women) to the detriment of everyone else.

Alex said...

What inquiring minds really want to know about Ms. Fluke:

* is she a real slut, sleeping around like a harlot

* is she a serial monogamist, getting a new boyfriend every few months?

* is she is a long-term relationship?

depending on the answer, I might change my opinion.

Jason said...

Alex,

If Ms. Fluke had been allowed to testify during Issa's hearing, do you think there would have been this much commotion?

This is a women's issue and women should have been permitted to participate in that hearing.


That is complete BS.

The issue isnt contraception - its whether it should be MANDATED in health insurance coverage. Health insurance that, should ObamaCare be enacted, that EVERYONE will have to buy. So stop saying that this is only a "womans issue". Its not.

The reason why conservatives are making this an issue is because minor things like this become major entitlements down the road. What's next that the left wants mandated that everyone should have to pitch in for?

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

"Translation - you want the government to intrude in favor of some special interest group(promiscuous young women) to the detriment of everyone else."

There are kinds of special interest groups reaping benefits from the government. And this is most certainly a women's issue.

But you go on and keep thinking that way.

Alex said...

And this is most certainly a women's issue.

It's only an issue for promiscuous young women. Nuns, older women, Christian woman are not on board with this. So basically what you're saying is Obama is sewing up the slut vote.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

“That is complete BS.

The issue isnt contraception - its whether it should be MANDATED in health insurance coverage. Health insurance that, should ObamaCare be enacted, that EVERYONE will have to buy. So stop saying that this is only a "womans issue". Its not.

The reason why conservatives are making this an issue is because minor things like this become major entitlements down the road. What's next that the left wants mandated that everyone should have to pitch in for?”

In the previous post you stated that you cannot believe that the discussion over this garbage (meaning contraception) has reached the heights it has in a country where 1 in 10 people are out of work and the economy is on the brink. This latest post of yours just demonstrated why it is such an issue.

Keep on pushing women to Obama.

By the way, Limbaugh has now lost 5 sponsors, including:

1) Sleep Train Mattresses
2) Select Comfort Corporation, makers of the Sleep Number Bed
3) Quicken Loans
4) The Cleveland Cavaliers, NBA Basketball team
5) Citrix, makers of GoToMyPC

edutcher said...

36fsfiend said...

What about creating drones? What did you mean by that?

What, indeed.

Fiend thinks he's being cute.

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

"It's only an issue for promiscuous young women. Nuns, older women, Christian woman are not on board with this. So basically what you're saying is Obama is sewing up the slut vote."

Well, Sister Carol Keehan who is a nun and the president and CEO of the Catholic Health Association which runs the Catholic hospitals in this country disagrees with your position:

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/02/both-catholic-health-assn-and-planned-parenthood-say-theyre-pleased-with-contraception-rule-announcement/

Alex said...

By the way, Limbaugh has now lost 5 sponsors

I'll believe it matters when Clear Channel fires Mr. Anal Cyst.

Jason said...

By the way, Limbaugh has now lost 5 sponsors, including:

1) Sleep Train Mattresses
2) Select Comfort Corporation, makers of the Sleep Number Bed
3) Quicken Loans
4) The Cleveland Cavaliers, NBA Basketball team
5) Citrix, makers of GoToMyPC


Oh my. Whatever will Limbaugh do?

Alex said...

Well Sister Carol Keehan isn't a real Catholic then. I'm not religious, but I know enough about it to know that a Catholic does not support slutty behavior.

Anonymous said...

edutcher said...

"What, indeed.

Fiend thinks he's being cute."

edutcher,

No, I'm serious, what do you mean? Drones like in drone bees or un-piloted vehicles?

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

"Well Sister Carol Keehan isn't a real Catholic then. I'm not religious, but I know enough about it to know that a Catholic does not support slutty behavior."

I think a lot of Catholics in this country would disagree with you about Sister Carol Keehan.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

"By the way, Limbaugh has now lost 5 sponsors, including:

1) Sleep Train Mattresses
2) Select Comfort Corporation, makers of the Sleep Number Bed
3) Quicken Loans
4) The Cleveland Cavaliers, NBA Basketball team
5) Citrix, makers of GoToMyPC

Oh my. Whatever will Limbaugh do?"

I don't know but it will be interesting to see if he continues to step in it.

Like I stated earlier, he's only helping Obama at this point.

Methadras said...

Canuck said...

okey dokey.

Get ready to loose the next election and not get the Senate.

The pill is used for many medical reasons that have nothing to do with pregnancy. The pill isn't what it was in the 1970s and it's not used as it was in the 1970s.

But y'all have fun alienating American women and calling them sluts.


Of course the pill is used for things other than contraception, but that isn't the context the tramp used to ask for free contraception. Get it straight and stop straw manning.

Alex said...

well at this rate Clear Channel will have to dump Limbaugh, but it's not the end Rushbots! There is still the internet and Rush's streaming website still lives! Rush can continue spewing his vile crap for 3 million people/week instead of 20.

Jason said...

Well, Sister Carol Keehan who is a nun and the president and CEO of the Catholic Health Association which runs the Catholic hospitals in this country disagrees with your position:

The CHA doesnt "run Catholic hospitals". Its a trade association. The CHA has no authority to speak for the Catholic church on issues like faith and morals.

Keenan is hardly an authority figure. She is often rebuked by those in the Catholic community for her stances, many of which are directly against basic Catholic teaching.

Try again.

elyse said...

Do men even realize women have to use the pill for many other reasons besides birth control? Also, even if you have sex once a month you still have to take the pill every single day. Limbaugh is a complete moron (whatever his motives are) and so are the people who agree with him on this issue.

somefeller said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
somefeller said...

Methradas says:Of course the pill is used for things other than contraception, but that isn't the context the tramp used to ask for free contraception. Get it straight and stop straw manning.

Actually, she was also discussing uses other than contraception, such as for control of ovarian cysts, as pointed out here. Though contraception is itself a valid medical purpose, as shown by the fact that it's commonly covered under health insurance.

And nice work calling her a tramp. Are you jealous because she's out of your league? I realize that a pretty young woman from a top law school isn't the type to give a loser like you the time of day, but you should try and tamp down the resentment.

Alex said...

Limbaugh is a complete moron (whatever his motives are) and so are the people who agree with him on this issue.

You are an amazing contributor to civility in discourse.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

“The CHA doesnt "run Catholic hospitals". Its a trade association. The CHA has no authority to speak for the Catholic church on issues like faith and morals.

Keenan is hardly an authority figure. She is often rebuked by those in the Catholic community for her stances, many of which are directly against basic Catholic teaching.”

I didn’t state that the CHA spoke for the church. But Keenan’s support did help to get the ACA passed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Health_Association_of_the_United_States

She must have some influence with Catholics.

Anonymous said...

craftygirl said...

"Do men even realize women have to use the pill for many other reasons besides birth control? Also, even if you have sex once a month you still have to take the pill every single day."

craftygirl,

From some of the responses on this thread, apparently not.

Unknown said...

IS this true?

Yeah, and she’s been a plant the whole time. She’s 30, not 23, as they first tried to tell us. She was a women’s reproductive rights activist before law school and chose Georgetown SPECIFICALLY because it doesn’t cover contraception and she could ride that to fame and acclaim.

Anonymous said...

We're up to 6 sponsors lost now:

1) Sleep Train Mattresses
2) Select Comfort Corporation, makers of the Sleep Number Bed
3) Quicken Loans
4) The Cleveland Cavaliers, NBA Basketball team
5) Citrix, makers of GoToMyPC
6) LegalZoom.com

It's like being at the races.

somefeller said...

She was a women’s reproductive rights activist before law school and chose Georgetown SPECIFICALLY because it doesn’t cover contraception and she could ride that to fame and acclaim.

Yeah, that's it. She chose Georgetown specifically for that purpose. The fact that it's a top law school in DC (where political activists like to work) had nothing to do with it, I'm sure. And of course, potential law students can pick and choose anywhere they want to go to school. It's a total buyer's market for students.

But one thing's for sure, she has gotten fame and acclaim out of this and she probably has a bright future with a good law firm, governmental or public interest outfit. Which is something that the Limbaugh crowd knows deep down and that only feeds the resentment further.

Unknown said...

Men would like their reproductive freedom also. I'm fine if the girlfriend goes out and gets pregnant or gets an abortion just ask me to pay for either unless we have a contract. Become a ward of the Obama state.

Jason said...

We're up to 6 sponsors lost now:

1) Sleep Train Mattresses
2) Select Comfort Corporation, makers of the Sleep Number Bed
3) Quicken Loans
4) The Cleveland Cavaliers, NBA Basketball team
5) Citrix, makers of GoToMyPC
6) LegalZoom.com

It's like being at the races.


Im sure that losing LegalZoom.com is gonna put the show in the red.

*roll eyes*

Jason said...

Men would like their reproductive freedom also.

Well, since liberal women all over the country are arguing for mandated contraception coverage, I want all men to march onto Washington and argue that rubbers be covered too.

Anonymous said...

Jason said...

"I'm sure that losing LegalZoom.com is gonna put the show in the red.

*roll eyes*"

It indicates that more people are becoming aware of the issue thanks to Limbaugh's attacks on Ms. Fluke.
Who would have thought before this brouhaha "Rush Limbaugh, Obama supporter"

Maybe Obama really is playing 11th dimensional chess?

Methadras said...

Alex said...

Bristol Palin was called a slut by Letterman and there wasn't 1/10th the anger by the media.

Because the Palin's are the butt of all jokes. Ms. Fluke is a respectable Georgetown law student. Bow down dittohead.


So did you ask Bill Maher for an apology when he repeatedly called Palin a cunt? I'd like to see that letter.

Methadras said...

somefeller said...

Methradas says:Of course the pill is used for things other than contraception, but that isn't the context the tramp used to ask for free contraception. Get it straight and stop straw manning.

Actually, she was also discussing uses other than contraception, such as for control of ovarian cysts, as pointed out here. Though contraception is itself a valid medical purpose, as shown by the fact that it's commonly covered under health insurance.

And nice work calling her a tramp. Are you jealous because she's out of your league? I realize that a pretty young woman from a top law school isn't the type to give a loser like you the time of day, but you should try and tamp down the resentment.


Lol. Since i've been married for over 20 some odd years to a woman who still looks like Michelle Pfiefer in her 20's, I'll go stare in the mirror for a little while and chuckle at how jealous I am. She's out of my league in the same way that she would still be staring up at it trying to get in. Puh-fucking-leeze.

Methadras said...

Jason said...

"By the way, Limbaugh has now lost 5 sponsors, including:

1) Sleep Train Mattresses
2) Select Comfort Corporation, makers of the Sleep Number Bed
3) Quicken Loans
4) The Cleveland Cavaliers, NBA Basketball team
5) Citrix, makers of GoToMyPC

Oh my. Whatever will Limbaugh do?"

I don't know but it will be interesting to see if he continues to step in it.

Like I stated earlier, he's only helping Obama at this point.


Oh, they'll be back in due course when their brand starts to take a hit from people not using them. It works both ways.

edutcher said...

somefeller said...

She was a women’s reproductive rights activist before law school and chose Georgetown SPECIFICALLY because it doesn’t cover contraception and she could ride that to fame and acclaim.

Yeah, that's it. She chose Georgetown specifically for that purpose. The fact that it's a top law school in DC (where political activists like to work) had nothing to do with it, I'm sure. And of course, potential law students can pick and choose anywhere they want to go to school. It's a total buyer's market for students.


Wrong.

She chose the Hoyas for exactly that reason.

But one thing's for sure, she has gotten fame and acclaim out of this and she probably has a bright future with a good law firm, governmental or public interest outfit.

Assuming the welfare state doesn't come crashing down.

And fame and acclaim are not all that makes a good lawyer.

Just being a good little rabble rouser and Lefty shill won't get her far.

Anonymous said...

Methadras said...

“Oh, they'll be back in due course when their brand starts to take a hit from people not using them. It works both ways.”

Methadras,

Maybe so. But now whenever the contraception issue comes up for discussion, many more people will now be linking Limbaugh with calling a young woman a “slut” and a “prostitute” and stating that he wanted to see pornographic movies of her.

A real family values kind of guy, isn’t he?

somefeller said...

The article you cite doesn't provide proof that she chose Georgetown Law School for that reason, it just asserts that claim as a fact. And as I pointed out, it isn't exactly easy to get into Georgetown. They pick you, not the other way around. Also, she's never hid the fact that she's a feminist activist. That was explicitly stated in her public statement.

As far as the other stuff you say is concerned, time will tell, but I suspect her chances of having a good career are much better than those of most of her critics.

Alex said...

Maybe so. But now whenever the contraception issue comes up for discussion, many more people will now be linking Limbaugh with calling a young woman a “slut” and a “prostitute” and stating that he wanted to see pornographic movies of her.

You well overestimate how many people are actually following the kerfuffle.

somefeller said...

And in any case, if she chose to go to Georgetown (after being admitted - which isn't something most prospective law students can do) in part because she wanted to challenge its policies on certain matters, so what? There are conservative students who will say that they went to a particular school (Berkeley, Harvard, etc.) because they wanted to push back in a liberal environment. That doesn't somehow mean their positions are false or that they should be referred to as sluts or prostitutes by rabid talk show hosts because they testified in support of a given position.

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

“You well overestimate how many people are actually following the kerfuffle.”

I don’t think so Alex. I mean the President of the United States made a personal phone call to the woman involved. That’s pretty high level and you know it’s going to continue to get coverage.

You know what would be interesting to see is if the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops will come out and repudiate Limbaugh as an ally in their fight against the contraception mandate.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Alex said...

I don’t think so Alex. I mean the President of the United States made a personal phone call to the woman involved. That’s pretty high level and you know it’s going to continue to get coverage.

#1 - Obama is part of the left-wing cabal that will use any opportunity to hush Rush

#2 - You really overestimate how deeply the average voter follows the news. This whole thing will blow over in 2-3 days.

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

“#1 - Obama is part of the left-wing cabal that will use any opportunity to hush Rush

#2 - You really overestimate how deeply the average voter follows the news. This whole thing will blow over in 2-3 days.”

I don’t think they are trying to hush him up, I think they will give enough rope and see if he hangs himself.

As far as this issue blowing over in 2-3 days, that depends somewhat on Limbaugh, right? He might come out blasting again on Monday for all we know.

The contraception and healthcare issues are not going away anytime soon. They're central to the 2012 election. I’m sure the media and the Democrats will attempt to highlight this kerfuffle whenever the issue comes up.

Alex said...

The contraception and healthcare issues are not going away anytime soon. They're central to the 2012 election.

Ah yes, you'd think with a crumbling economy and war brewing in the Middle East that those would be TOP issues, but no. It's sex and religion once again.

Duncan said...

You can obtain oral generics for $20-30/month. Georgetown Law costs more than $60k a year. Student loans are government subsidies of what they are used for. Obamacare doesn't mandate coverage of students. Ms. Fluke has been arguing for widespread, free, female contraception, steralization, and chemical aborficants including many cases involving govt subsidy. One could suggest that students should not get govt foodstamps and pills since they can work instead of attending college. Such subsidies are an income transfer from the poor to the rich. College students are wealthier than the general population. Two women did testify at the Issa hearing. Ms. Fluke has declined to discuss the constitutional issues (the subject of the hearing) merely stateing that it was about women's health not religious liberty. Begging the question of why the HHS Sec (Obama's Vicar on Earth), exempted churches themselves.

master cylinder said...

sheesh. lets go back, waaaaay back Old White People.

Anonymous said...

Alex said...

“Ah yes, you'd think with a crumbling economy and war brewing in the Middle East that those would be TOP issues, but no. It's sex and religion once again.”

Well Alex, why is that? Which party is making it the major issue? I don’t think Limbaugh’s reprehensible attacks on Flukes are helping the effort. Those actions have escalated the rhetoric.

The Crack Emcee said...

They demand we buy their birth control, but don’t require their dates to buy them dinner before using it.

Discuss.

Alex said...

They demand we buy their birth control, but don’t require their dates to buy them dinner before using it.

Birth control pills are used for many purposes other then preventing pregnancy.

Alex said...

Taking oral contraceptives also reduces the risk of colorectal cancer, and improves conditions such as pelvic inflammatory disease, dysmenorrhea, premenstrual syndrome, and acne.[83] Additionally, birth control pills reduce symptoms of polycystic ovary syndrome, and decrease the risk of anemia.[84]

Why do GOP troglodytes hate women's health?

Anonymous said...

Duncan said...

"Two women did testify at the Issa hearing."

Duncan,

Issa's first panel on contraception coverage had zero female witnesses.

The five witnesses on the first panel were all male religious leaders or professors, including a Catholic bishop. Two women were listed on the committee website as witnesses for a second, later panel but the first panel tends to draw the most attention at hearings.

Anonymous said...

"Do men even realize women have to use the pill for many other reasons besides birth control? Also, even if you have sex once a month you still have to take the pill every single day."

Some men apparently do not know this. I think most middle age and younger men know how the pill works, but perhaps I'm wrong.

Yeah, I'm surprised and fascinated. I thought everybody was up-to-date on these things.

The Crack Emcee said...

36fsfiend,

Which party is making it the major issue?

War Room Georgie brought it up, so that would be the Democrats.

I don’t think Limbaugh’s reprehensible attacks on Flukes are helping the effort.

"Reprehensible attacks"? Have you people ever listened to Limbaugh before? Do you know what a media tweak is? Do you know what a joke is? Satire? He's a god damned radio talk show host. He's laughing, even if you aren't. Get a clue.

Those actions have escalated the rhetoric.

Oh yeah. And the President of the United States - ostensibly the most powerful man in the world - getting involved is nothing. It's all about that powerless guy at the radio station - he did it, he caused all the wreckage. That $5 trillion dollars Obama washed down the toilet? Means nothing. El Rushbo holds all the cards.

Jesus, you people are stupid sometimes,...

The Crack Emcee said...

Alex,

Why do GOP troglodytes hate women's health?

Because if I have to pay for mine then they have to pay for theirs.

My turn:

Why is everyone so fucking stupid now?

The Crack Emcee said...

36fsfiend,

Issa's first panel on contraception coverage had zero female witnesses.

It was also on the constitutionality of the issue, so - unless it was Althouse testifying - why was it necessary to have women there?

Oh yeah - they have vaginas.

I'm outta here, my I.Q.s too high tonight for this nonsense,...

Anonymous said...

Crack Emcee.

I’m not familiar with the term War Room Georgie. Please explain.

“Reprehensible attacks"? Have you people ever listened to Limbaugh before? Do you know what a media tweak is? Do you know what a joke is? Satire? He's a god damned radio talk show host. He's laughing, even if you aren't. Get a clue.”

Well these “jokes” and this “satire” are certainly causing a response. Would you like someone to jokingly call your daughter a “slut” or a “prostitute” or state on the public airways that he wants to see your daughter in porn flicks?

“Oh yeah. And the President of the United States - ostensibly the most powerful man in the world - getting involved is nothing. It's all about that powerless guy at the radio station - he did it, he caused all the wreckage. That $5 trillion dollars Obama washed down the toilet? Means nothing. El Rushbo holds all the cards.”

Boss Limbaugh is powerless? Really? Just some guy sitting in a little radio station. Is that why some members of Congress don’t seem willing to cross him?

Anonymous said...

The Crack Emcee said...

"It was also on the constitutionality of the issue, so - unless it was Althouse testifying - why was it necessary to have women there?"

Why is a bishop required to discuss constitutional issues?


"Oh yeah - they have vaginas.:"

No wonder the Republican Party is pushing women away.

Saint Croix said...

I need a condom
A condom, condom
I need a condom and a condom and a condom
Three thousands condoms
Right now!
I need three thousand condoms
For my love
I got a lot of love
Do not hate me for my love
My condom-needing love
Do not hate me you hater
You hater hater
Oh I hate the hater haters
Die you hater
You should die a thousand deaths from cancer
And a sharp stick in the eye
All I want are condoms
Condom condoms
Just give me my condoms
And I won’t hate you, you hater
There will be peace in the land
Peace and socialism
And condoms
Lots and lots of condoms
Oh Mr President
I cannot believe what he said about me
Thank you for your phone call
It means a lot
Also for your condom plan
Free condoms
Lots and lots of condoms
Three thousand condoms for me!

Anonymous said...

"What's really at stake is the presidential election." Obama is as well as reelected already. George Will got it completely right: it is time to start thinking about a plan B. Not that there is much hope of that ever doing much good either. That is probably the greatest sin of conservatives like Will and Limbaugh - peddling the notion that there is any kind of future for the country post-Obama. There isn't. We are doomed. And the country has not been anything to be patriotic about at least since Wickard v. Filburn.

Alex said...

That is probably the greatest sin of conservatives like Will and Limbaugh - peddling the notion that there is any kind of future for the country post-Obama. There isn't. We are doomed.

Hey Chicken Little, I have more faith in the USA.

MayBee said...

A commenter at Volkh points out it's a bit hard to get too upset at "slut" after two years of "teabagger".
Not to mention all the people who have been called "racist" in the past few years.

I'd rather be a slut than racist.

edutcher said...

somefeller said...

The article you cite doesn't provide proof that she chose Georgetown Law School for that reason, it just asserts that claim as a fact.

And here's Fox News saying the same thing, as does the WaPo.

And as I pointed out, it isn't exactly easy to get into Georgetown. They pick you, not the other way around. Also, she's never hid the fact that she's a feminist activist. That was explicitly stated in her public statement.

Whether they picked her is beside the point.

She's billed originally as a 23 year old student, instead of a 30 year old activist.

She's represented herself as something she's not, so she's a fraud and a liar.

Just what any good law firm wants.

Whether they accepted her application or not,
As far as the other stuff you say is concerned, time will tell, but I suspect her chances of having a good career are much better than those of most of her critics.


Most of her critics already have good careers.

And they don't have to lie to have them.

Joe Schmoe said...

Random responses:

Hi John Stodder. I read you.

Bill Maher goes after every lefty's favorite punching bag Joe the Plumber, a private citizen. (cue up lefty whining about Joe somehow fabricating celebrity status for himself, thus opening himself up to all the opprobrium he deserved)

Obama calling family of slain ATF or border patrol agent? I believe he did. Eric Holder, though, had to be dragged into writing a letter of condolence and apology several weeks or months after the fact.

Vasectomies are NOT always covered by insurance plans. My current plan doesn't cover it. Wish it did.

I don't get Rush's show in my area, but he sounds bored. The optics of an older, rich white guy picking on a younger woman aren't great. He has a point, but he's using a 16-lb. maul to drive a brad nail.

Jane the Actuary said...

Limbaugh went too far, as he does sometimes.

How about we just criticize her powers of reasoning and/or label her a liar? Does she not understand that if contraceptives were covered, the cost would be shared by her fellow students, so she's asking the celibate to subsidize the sexually active (or the cheap B.C. users to subsidize the users of expensive products), nothing else? And you know that she constructed the $3000 as a worst-case hypothetical. A "nuvaring" that's in the news lately costs $90 per month at drugstore.com. Yaz (another name-brand, new product) is $93/month. The Ortho-Evra "Patch" is even pricier -- $113/month. There are probably some others, newer and still patent-protected, that cost that much. Add in a set of "Plan B" pills, and you can construct a hypothetical scenario -- but most of these more-expensive contraceptives are intended to offer more convenience, not to diminish side effects or offer more effectiveness.

ErnieG said...

If you can't afford contraceptives, just wear Crocs. Best birth control ever.

Almost Ali said...

Where's James Cagney and his grapefruit when you need'em.

SGT Ted said...

The issue is the lie she told to Congress. The lie that her friend was "unable to get contraception" because she couldn't pay for very expensive prescription chemicals. There's a condom display very near the Rx counter and they are cheap.

She was telling lies for personal gain in front of Congress. "Slut" doesn't even begin to describe this girl.

Having sex isn't a medical issue. It's a personal issue. Men used to be responsible for bringing the condom. Now that women are expected to take responsibility, they want it at extrememly reduced rates or for free, and they want their choice, regardless of cost.

Men and women can both get a vasectomy or tubed tied under insurance. Thats a one and done. Viagra is for a medical disfunction, not a contraceptive for already functioning genitalia.

If women want to pay extra on thier HC plan for expensive BC chemicals, then there's no problem. If they can't afford the extra for expensive BC chemicals, theres' always condoms, which are far more effective at preventing disease than expensive chemical pills.

And if private companies don't want to cover contraception costs, there should be no law forcing them to do so, simply because the buyer is a woman. That is the real issue.

lav8erdude said...

Abstinence has always been the BEST form of birth control. It's 100% effective....and it's FREE!
Worry about your law degree education for now, you'll have plenty of time later to screw EVERYBODY as an attorney...

lav8erdude said...

Abstinence has always been the BEST form of birth control. It's 100% effective....and it's FREE!
Worry about your law degree education for now, you'll have plenty of time later to screw EVERYBODY as an attorney...

Ed Darrell said...

You "like" Rush Limbaugh?

It's way past time for people to admit that on all issues, Limbaugh is equally disgusting and equally in error as he is on this one.

Limbaugh still hasn't acknowledged even error in his defense of renegades butchering and mutilating children and women in Congo -- Limbaugh supports them because they claim to be Christian.

As a Christian, I object to supporting someone with such questionable morals as to cheer rape and mutilation as something Christians would do, let alone the morality of the acts themselves.

Althouse supports this stuff? Really?

I don't have daughters, but if I did, I think I might get a pitchfork and march on Rush's studio. My sons are disgusted with him. What human would not be?

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