October 26, 2012

Camille Paglia, who voted for Obama in '08, delivers a fine rant about why she's not voting for him this time.

She's interviewed on video here, by Glenn Reynolds. Most of the interview is about art in America and her new book "Glittering Images" (which I just bought, in Kindle). But in the end, she's asked why she's not voting for Obama — she's voting for Jill Stein — and out flow the words, which I started transcribing without knowing how long she'd go on. I kept transcribing, because it was all such great material, so here it is (with a few screen grabs, taken from the art section of the interview):
I was very excited about him. I thought he was a moderate. I thought that his election would promote racial healing in the country. 
This is the point at which I started transcribing, thinking: This is how I felt, when I voted for Obama in 2008. Except I wouldn't say I was "very excited." I wasn't caught up in the ecstasy. I thought it was the better bet, compared to the GOP alternative, and I hoped for the moderation and advancement in attitudes about race.
It would be a tremendous transformation of attitudes. And instead: one thing after another. Not least: I consider him, now, one of the most racially divisive and polarizing figures ever. I think it's going to take years to undo the damage to relationships between the races. 


Yes, this hope for racial transformation got squandered early, over that awful Henry Louis Gates incident. Back to Paglia:
But beyond that, I am just sick and tired of endless war. I was in favor of bombing the hell out of the Afghanistan mountains after 9/11, but I would have never agreed to this land war in Afghanistan, this endless land war, as well as things like this Libyan incursion that Obama appears to have been pushed into by these women, like Hillary Clinton and Samantha Power, the chaos in foreign policy, the bowing to foreign leaders.

Also the Obamacare: of course, we need health care reform in this country. What a mess! Everyone agrees about that. But the Obamacare is, to me, a Stalinist intrusion — okay? — into American culture.

The creation of this culture of surveillance, from these bureaucracies, which is also carried over into Obama's endorsement of drones on the military level as well as for police control of the population. I mean, I don't understand how any... veteran of the 1960s who's a Democrat could not see the dangers here, that Obama is a statist. It's exactly what Bob Dylan was warning about in "Subterranean Homesick Blues," okay?
I paused the video at "It's exactly what Bob Dylan was warning about" and asked Meade what song she's about to name, and he said "Masters of War," and I said "That's what I thought." But it's "Subterranean Homesick Blues," and as soon as she says it, we know why. (Look out kid/They keep it all hid/Better jump down a manhole/Light yourself a candle...)
You don't want government agencies being empowered to intrude into people's lives like this. The controlling force in Obamacare is the IRS! Okay? This flies in the face of what the Free Speech Movement was about at Berkeley or about any of the values, I feel, of my generation.


Yes. Exactly. This is how the Democratic Party lost me — by trading freedom for statism.
So I feel the Democratic Party needs to be shattered and remade to recover its true progressive roots. I don't see progressives. All I see is white upper-middle-class liberals who speak in this unctuous way about the needs of the poor.
Unctuous. Yes. White upper-middle-class liberals lubricating themselves.
They have no connection whatever with the working class. Okay? It's the professional class gone amok. And that's why they don't notice what a bureaucratic nightmare Obamacare is.

255 comments:

1 – 200 of 255   Newer›   Newest»
Mark O said...

She's always interesting in a wonderful way. One may not agree with her, though on this I do, but she delivers a thoughtful and compelling argument every time.

Compare her intellect to Obama's and submit your paper by noon.

Renee said...

Thank You.

Methadras said...

Democrats shattered to become a new progressive roots party? ROFL!!! What have you been missing paglia, this is what progressivism is you addled moron. You got it here. Now.

AF said...

But the Obamacare is, to me, a Stalinist intrusion — okay? — into American culture.

And dammit, we want Stalinism on the state level only. Not the federal level.

Incidentally, Jill Stein who Paglia is voting for favors Medicare for all. Is government provided health insurance less Stalinist?

Bill, Republic of Texas said...

Spot on.

I agree exactly with her analysis about the Dems going all upper middle class bullshit. We need one party in this country on the side of the working people.

The Dems have gone totally to the statist model. Tear down the party and rebuild it in the mold of FDR and JFK. I want to be a Dem but they keep pushing me away and telling me I'm not welcome.

david7134 said...

What is it about you people. Obama would not be able to pass a job interview, much less be considered President. But this woman and many others got all emotional and forgot to look at what the nut was saying. He is a Marxist and the group that supports him wants to see our country beaten down. They accomplished that, so thanks to women who can't understand what a person is saying, writting or the nature of his lifestyle that should have been flags that he is bad.

Lem said...

Paglia punches out Powell...

Birches said...

Wow. I'm glad someone has the brains to recognize the Statism. My husband and I were talking last night after the entire commercial break was taken up entirely by political ads. We decided that politics is just another version of sports, "well its ok when my team does it, but not yours because you're evil." I'm excited to vote for Romney because I think he'll be a good President, but if he's as good I want him to be, I think the Republican Party is probably going to hate him just like the Dems used to hate Clinton so much.

bagoh20 said...

What happened to women in 2008? There was absolutely no way you could come to those conclusions back then based on the evidence of Obama's words, and especially his history - you know actual facts.

You can't just wish things into being. When you decide with your heart, you know what organ you don't use? We gave the vote to women, not to girls.

Paul said...

"Unctuous. Yes. White upper-middle-class liberals lubricating themselves."

And screaming about racism from the safe enclaves of lily whiteness they inhabit.

I think the most pertinent quality of modern liberals is their arrested state of adolescence, and the arrogance, ignorance, self righteousness, and nastiness that is inherent in that emotionally stunted state lasts far longer into adulthood than it should in healthy human beings.

TWM said...
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Robert Cook said...

Like Paglia, I'm voting for Jill Stein. Unlike her, I didn't vote for Obama the first time.

The game was up when Obama voted FOR the revised FISA law before he was elected President, betraying his purported principles and his asserted intentions. A man so heedless of his integrity and of his promises to his supporters before his win was assured was clearly a man who would have no compunction about betraying all his promises or his supporters after his win. Anyone could and should have seen this.

What else has his term in office been but a serial betrayal of all he promised and of all to whom he made his promises? And yet, many of them still support him!

TWM said...

She describes herself as a Clinton Democrat/libertarian. Let's hope others like her vote for anyone but Obama

john sager said...

I have liked her since I first heard her some twenty years ago. But then I wondered how she was a Democrat voter.

Where have all the honest Democrats gone? It's really a shame for our country how they so readily traipse toward wickedness.

TosaGuy said...

"All I see is white upper-middle-class liberals who speak in this unctuous way about the needs of the poor."

Yes. In Milwaukee, the area between Lake Michigan and the Milwaukee River is called the East Side and the suburbs Shorewood and Whitefish Bay. UW-Milwaukee has a campus here and it also has all the big old nice mansions and vintage 1920s high-end houses. It's a nice spot, except there is absolutely no place to park.

It is also inhabited by the type of liberal creature to which Paglia refers. These people profess a great concern for the poor, but prefer that they stay on the west side of the Milwaukee River.

Original Mike said...

" I thought it was the better bet, compared to the GOP alternative, and I hoped for the moderation and advancement in attitudes about race."

She chose, poorly.

john sager said...

The leather coat thing is a bit much, but I'll give her the props for having earned it.

marshall2twr said...

Ann,

Just when was the moment that the democrats lost you?

Before or after you voted for Obama?

Sammy said...

Her Salon interview from last week was great, a worth while read about why she wouldn't be voting for Obama, and why she turned on him barely 6 months into his Presidency.

Pastafarian said...

Before anyone gives Althouse or Paglia shit for their 2008 choice:

Maybe they were right.

We don't know how bad McCain would have been, how many of the same disastrous policies he would have reached across the aisle to embrace, destroying the conservative brand for a generation in the process.

It may turn out that Obama is to the economy what fire is to forests: Post-Obama, we might see lush verdant growth in our economy, like you see after the cleansing purge of a really brutal wildfire.

And wouldn't it be something if we saw from this a reformation of the left? If we saw real liberals, not statist leftists, regain control of that movement?

Hagar said...

"This is how the Democratic Party lost me — "

Finally the magic words!

Robert Cook said...

"He is a Marxist...."

Hahahahahaha!

At this late date, such delusion is astonishing to see.

Rob said...

You are both knotheads who don't know how to learn about a person's past political positions. MODERATE! ARGH!

bagoh20 said...

All these atrocities in the the Dem party did not start after 2008.

jr565 said...

(Look out kid/They keep it all hid/Better jump down a manhole/Light yourself a candle...)


Great lyrics on that one.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

@ Paglia....be careful about what you desire, you might actually get it. And now, you don't like it. Well.....neither do we.

As pointed out. THIS is exactly what progressive-ism has always been about. State control. For your own good, of course, since the proletariat obviously need their betters to plan their lives.

Unctuous. Perfect word to describe the self satisfied, self congratulatory, totally and willfully blind liberals. The Bay Area of California is oozing with them

David said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
edutcher said...

OK, a proxy "How Obama Lost Me".

I'll take it.

Sometimes you have to hear the words come out of somebody else's mouth to realize you feel that way, too.

Shouting Thomas said...

Jill Stein?

She's voting for Jill Stein?

Jesus, God and Mary, save us from the perfessors.

Michael K said...

"Incidentally, Jill Stein who Paglia is voting for favors Medicare for all. Is government provided health insurance less Stalinist?"

No, it just goes broke faster.

Patrick said...

Incidentally, Jill Stein who Paglia is voting for favors Medicare for all. Is government provided health insurance less Stalinist?

I don't understand that either.

MadisonMan said...

Fine rant indeed. And I can't argue against any of her points.

Two abysmal choices in 2008 leads to only one choice in 2012 as far as I'm concerned.

Seeing Red said...

Poor Camille, no fool like an old fool.

Moderate? Barry?

Love her, tho.

Via Walter R. Mead's article on IL:

...The French say that behind every great fortune lies a great crime. But it is also true to say that behind every great failure lies a great blunder. Late 20th century American liberalism is wrong about the way the world works. It doesn’t understand cause and effect very well. It cannot feed itself. Given full power it cannot design and implement policies that advance the causes it honors. Modern American liberalism can only win Pyrrhic victories, because liberals in power take steps that advance their decline.....



Renee said...

I watched the whole 15 minutes, and placed her book for hold at the library.

I'm interested, because I have a son who is artistic and he does go into that 'abstract' genre, that I don't care for. Now I know why.

He likes Star Wars too!

Levi Starks said...

She better be careful, she may be on the schedule for an eight am visit from the curly haired strongman.

Shouting Thomas said...

So, she goes on a rant about the disconnect of the Democratic Party from the middle class...

Then she announces she's gonna vote for the boutique SWPL green party candidate.

I hope she gets a complimentary artisanal chocolate bar for her vote.

AF said...

Fine rant indeed. And I can't argue against any of her points.

Yes, it's hard to argue against them because they're incoherent.

Renee said...

The things about the Green Party is that they're sincere in their beliefs. Even if you totally disagree with them, you feel like this person lives in your neighborhood and deals with the same day to day concerns.

Original Mike said...

MM makes news.

Synova said...

Progressive has always meant statist, hasn't it?

The focus, at one time, was on liberal attitudes toward others and individual human dignity. That's not progressive to me. Humanism, right? Tolerance, free speech for those saying what you hate, and not harshing anyone's mellow.

That's why we talk about classical liberalism... that thing that had to do with the universality of individual dignity and universal principles of freedom. Not "multi-cultural" contexts that make oppression acceptable if that's what a culture expects, but an assumption that all people want to and ought to be free individuals.

But talking about individuals rather than groups is coming dangerously close to getting libertarian cooties these days and progressives are government-down group oriented. Always have been.

bagoh20 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
EDH said...

AF said...
Incidentally, Jill Stein who Paglia is voting for favors Medicare for all. Is government provided health insurance less Stalinist?

I don't think Paglia is saying she'll voting for Stein because Paglia thinks Stein will win.

I'll speculate here: I think Paglia wants to like Romney, and for Paglia that's best presented as a pleasant surprise from an arms-length distance, especially after her experience with Obama.

Although I think the "endless war" thing will make that problematic if there are continued casualties and entanglements.

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

I get the feeling that Althouse is preparing the battlefield for her election endorsement.

Unknown said...

"So I feel the Democratic Party needs to be shattered and remade to recover its true progressive roots. I don't see progressives. All I see is white upper-middle-class liberals who speak in this unctuous way about the needs of the poor."

This is exactly what happened to the Republican party, and not an election too soon. The Tea Party is at its core a bunch of conservative-libertarians who looked around and said, "Where is the party that represents ME?" There wasn't one. The Republican party had been claiming to be for twenty years, but had become something else entirely. So they tore it down and started over.

Personally, I would like to see the Democratic party go through a similar transformation. I'm not sure what that would look like. The current melange of disaffected minorities and unions can't hold for much longer.

Drago said...

AF: "And dammit, we want Stalinism on the state level only. Not the federal level."

It's not "Stalinism on the state level" since you could always move 20 miles up the road and live in New Hampshire without being shot.

The being shot part is always left out of the story when the left references their marxist/leninist/stalinist dream states.

Not to mention that the Constitution does not forbid the enactment of such a law at the State level.

But hey, for Ezra Klein and AF, that Constitution "thingy" is like, really old and hard to understand.

bagoh20 said...

"We don't know how bad McCain would have been.

Or how good he could have been, which strangely nobody ever even considers, which you would do in a balanced analysis.

We knew much less about how bad Obama could have been. He could have been much worse (we got lucky), and he may still get another 4 years to prove how bad he can be.

No, we fantasized about one man's abilities devoid of evidence, and exaggerated the other man's faults to the ridiculous level of a loose cannon, despite a long career.

It was simply bad, lazy, decision making. And as bad as it is, we did dodge a bullet despite foolishly picking a complete unknown, unproven man for the most important job in the world.

Hagar said...

Obama is not a Marxist; he is a variety of cargo cultist.

ooonaughtykitty said...

Wonderful! Thank you.

virgil xenophon said...

""...submit your paper by noon."

No need. As one of my undergrad math professors used to do when he would stop and say half-way thru the proof, jumping directly to the resultant: "The answer from here is intuitively obvious." Obama is a Marxist cum Fascist Statist all the way. Period. (Btw, Hitler is on record in a newspaper interview in 1938 when asked what the differences between the Soviet Communists and his National Socialist party were, he answered: "Oh, I think they will eventually end up where we already are." (And he was right! Hitler was a FAR better politician than the General tactician he fancied himself to be--another trait he shares w. Obama--except Hitler was a FAR better gimlet-eyed judge of political character..)

And oh yes, the women's vote for Obama being yet ANOTHER, MAJOR, IMPOSSIBLE TO IGNORE, reminder of the mistake made by endangering the future of the Republic by granting women the power of the vote. To date they're 0 for 3 on the really "BIG" questions--promotion of Prohibition, opposing US entry into WW II against Germany, and the election of Obama..

Drago said...

EDH: "I'll speculate here: I think Paglia wants to like Romney, and for Paglia that's best presented as a pleasant surprise from an arms-length distance, especially after her experience with Obama."

Paglia is always consistent with her principles and she does not for one minute buy into all of the utter PC anti-western culture nonsense that is spewed non-stop out of most of academia.

For instance, she is pro-choice, but insists on calling the destruction of the baby in the womb "murder" since it is intellectually dishonest to call it anything else.

This is a person with whom one can reason.

And by "reason", I mean reason in the classical Western cultural way.

Reagan said...

She is fully of crap and obviously has no experience in actually instituting programs or establishing policies. The president could not get buy-in for single payer (or was simply too "moderate" to try), so he goes with the Republican's Romneycare version, using private insurance and mandates to reduce the freeloaders, and this is somehow evidence of him NOT being a moderate? How else do you pay for expanded coverage? You can just make shit up. And her alternative is single payer, which is less invasive how? Whatever. She has made a career out of acting (and I do mean acting) like a contrarian. Sort of like Althouse does here on her blog. Paglia's entire take is predictable and borderline boring.

Quayle said...

What shall we say about the 60s kids?

In the name of love and peace, they rebelled against the materiality and rules of their parents, only to become far far more materialistic and oppressive in their rules.

They celebrated their ability to feel while they lost their ability to feel.

They destroyed order in the name of freedom, then turned back on themselves and sought to destroy freedom in the name of order.

Or as Yeats wrote:
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the center cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

Inga said...

Democrats, out of touch with the working class? Good grief.

And yes to Medicare for all!

TosaGuy said...

"Democrats, out of touch with the working class? Good grief."

Yes. You won't find a Milwaukee East Sider step foot in West Allis or Milwaukee's South Side without thinking they are a modern-day Margaret Mead.

Cosmic Conservative said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Christopher in MA said...

And dammit, we want Stalinism on the state level only. Not the federal level.

If a state decides they want to do something, AF, provided it does not adversely affect people, why shouldn't it? Why presume that ukases from the Federal Government can govern from Hawaii'i to Maine better than those individual legislatures can?


Before anyone gives Althouse or Paglia shit for their 2008 choice:

Maybe they were right.

We don't know how bad McCain would have been, how many of the same disastrous policies he would have reached across the aisle to embrace, destroying the conservative brand for a generation in the process.

It may turn out that Obama is to the economy what fire is to forests: Post-Obama, we might see lush verdant growth in our economy, like you see after the cleansing purge of a really brutal wildfire.

And wouldn't it be something if we saw from this a reformation of the left? If we saw real liberals, not statist leftists, regain control of that movement?


I'd agree, Pastafarian, but to the contrary, we (or, at least those not blinded by skin color, damp panties or bromances) knew how bad Obama would be. His record (and lack of it) was clear. His odious anti-American and racist associates. Perhaps memory of the stench of his disgusting administration will help return the country to founding principles, but that we now find ourselves only with hope and several thousand votes from going over the abyss should give anyone pause.

Titus said...

I like her because she is unpredictable.

She looks pretty good for her age too.

The leather jacket and hair works.

tits.

Seeing Red said...

Ronaldus Magnus:

Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they are ignorant, but that they know so much that isn’t so.


Socialism kills, free markets feed.

Ruth Anne Adams said...

My Brunch with Camille.

Shouting Thomas said...

Paglia wouldn't recognize an actual member of the middle class if she was run over by a Ford F150 playing "Sweet Home Alabama" on the sound system.

Jesus! What an effete SWPL clown!

wyo sis said...

You don't want government "agencies being empowered to intrude into people's lives like this. The controlling force in Obamacare is the IRS! Okay? This flies in the face of what the Free Speech Movement was about at Berkeley or about any of the values, I feel, of my generation.

Yes. Exactly. This is how the Democratic Party lost me — by trading freedom for statism."

But, statism is the logical outcome of the Berkeley movement as the "freedom" generation becomes the generation with power.

hawkeyedjb said...

"I don't see progressives. All I see is white upper-middle-class liberals who speak in this unctuous way about the needs of the poor."

Yeah, no kidding. I was a Democrat for a long time, but I was a Harry Truman-Henry Jackson-Hubert Humphrey Democrat. I liked Bubba too, because he actually knew and understood working people, and didn't look down on them. Obama and his ilk detest working people. His Bitter Clingers comment was the most honest thing he said in 2008, and it should have told us what was to come in the next four years. I hope he and his supporters get the chance to think about the world the rest of us live in, while they're bitterly clinging to their lattes and multiculturalism.

Ruth Anne Adams said...

How to survive a Frankenstorm with a post-structuralist.

Break. Blow. Burn.

Seeing Red said...

Inga still believes the spin that the pubbies are for the rich?

Opensecrets.org.


LOLOLOL

Titus said...

I agree with ST, who is spot on as usual.

She goes off on Obama, which I support, but then says she is voting for Jill Stein?

TosaGuy said...

I correct myself, Inga.

Democrats may very well be in touch with working-class folks. It is the liberals that have lost touch with them and hold them in contempt.

An error that many conservatives and Republicans make is to confuse liberal with Democrat. Someday, Democrats will recognize that liberals don't hold them in very high regard.

TosaGuy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mitchell the Bat said...

The Democratic Party left her?

This post needs a "Paglia is like Reagan" tag.

Christopher in MA said...

Democrats, out of touch with the working class? Good grief.

John Kerry's accountant would like a word with you.

virgil xenophon said...

TosaGuy@10:45/

LOL! SO true!!

TosaGuy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Seeing Red said...

Inga still believes that the pubbies are the party of the rich?

That hasn't been true for a long time.

opensecrets.org.


The richest congresscritters are usually democrat.

gbm said...

If Obamacare had been about health reform, then it would have provided for 16000 new doctors--not 16000 new IRS agents.

hombre said...

Let the destruction of Paglia begin.

Apostasy is not permitted. Off with her head!!

TosaGuy said...

"Paglia wouldn't recognize an actual member of the middle class if she was run over by a Ford F150 playing "Sweet Home Alabama" on the sound system.

Jesus! What an effete SWPL clown!"

That may be true, but I suspect that she knows the SWPL crowd very well.

gbm said...

If Obamacare had been about health reform, then it would have provided for 16000 new doctors--not 16000 new IRS agents.

Ned said...

"Yes. Exactly. This is how the Democratic Party lost me — by trading freedom for statism."

You really are like a child. 2 weeks ago you were unsure who to vote for...and then Rush ran a VIDEO...That's IT!!!!
You couldn't think your way out of a wet paper bag

Seeing Red said...

WRM's opening, via Insty:

Three states form the base of Democratic political power in the United States: California, New York and Illinois. All three states are locked in an accelerating economic, demographic and social decline; all three hope that they can stave off looming disaster at home by exporting the policies that have ruined them to the rest of the country.

--------------

Wait until Michigan enshrines union law.

Tim said...

Paglia was someone I started listening to years ago after learning that she listened to Rush. Just like Ann.

Thanks for this!

Seeing Red said...

Obamacare gives the King's Revenooers the right to go into your checking account.

virgil xenophon said...

A friend of mine once said years ago (anticipating Michael Savages' "Liberalism is a mental disease" meme) that "Liberals have a genetic defect which prevents them from processing reality and thus they live their entire lives in a state of denial."

My friend said that to a Professor of Sociology from Tulane in a somewhat heated discussion/BS session at an off-campus watering-hole, who, incensed, abruptly got up in high dudgeon and left the table--at which point my friend reached over and drank his beer. LOL!

SMGalbraith said...

Paglia's complaints about Afghanistan ring hollow to me.

Candidate/Senator Obama was pretty explicit about how he would expand the war there, about how it was a war of necessity and not choice and about how Bush dropped the ball by going into Iraq.

What did she think he was going to do there?

Marshal said...

It is interesting commentary. My response though is "look who just caught up". The Democratic Party has never been what she is describing.

bagoh20 said...

What I don't understand is how a university education can create such slow targeting, inaccurate - and in the end - random firing conclusions. Being a rube, can be very satisfying, especially on a Friday. I feel good, and relatively wise today.

John S. Wilson said...

I'm confused. Didn't Obama campaign on bringing universal healthcare in 2008? And Obamacare isn't even universal, isn't even single payer. So what did she think he meant by universal healthcare in 2008 when she decided to vote for him?

TosaGuy said...

A liberal Margaret Mead adventure amongst the working class may look something like this.

Ann Althouse said...

"Just when was the moment that the democrats lost you?"

Beginning on 9/11/01.

Seeing Red said...

Oh, boy:

Via Insty:

FOXNEWS: Report: Hillary Asked For More Security in Benghazi, Obama Said No.

Related: EXCLUSIVE: CIA operators were denied request for help during Benghazi attack, sources say. This is just looking worse and worse.

tiger said...

Geeze, who cares what she thinks?

She's basically an attention whore with a new book.

Besides she's voting for the Jack(?) what's his name.

Seeing Red said...

Geez, I wonder if Wretchard was right, setting up a hostage trade.

Peter said...

"I thought he [Obama] was a moderate."

OK, but why? Why would you think that, when the evidence was overwhelming that he'd always been thoroughly immersed in the culture of the far Left?

"So I feel the Democratic Party needs to be shattered and remade to recover its true progressive roots. I don't see progressives. All I see is white upper-middle-class liberals who speak in this unctuous way about the needs of the poor."

I uderstand what she means by "unctuous white upper-middle-class liberals," but what is a "progressive," and what are "true progressive roots"?

Most of the Progressive Era progressives were Republicans, but in any case this was almost a century ago. Surely she does not expect a revival of the Progressive Era? And even Progressive Era progressives were strongly statist.

So, Ms Paglia, what exactly is a present-day "progressive" if not a (sometimes unctuous) white upper-middle-class liberals?

tiger said...

So, she's voting for Jill Stein instead of the other guy and she's saying things people here agree with; that doesn't lessen her standing as an attention whore.

virgil xenophon said...

LOL TosaGuy. How did you find that site? I obviously don't get out often enough these days. I'd have been all over it circa 2004/5 when I had the time to do stream-of-consciousness surfing playing follow-the-interesting sounding-links all day..

Nonapod said...

But, statism is the logical outcome of the Berkeley movement as the "freedom" generation becomes the generation with power.

But don't ya see? It's all about getting the nice, agreeable people into positions of power, not the conservative meanies. It's all about achieving the benevolent State that looks after you from cradle to grave. OK... OK... maybe we have to give up some freedoms... or a lot of freedoms to get there. But we're all such simple children after all, and we require good, beneficent overlords to mind us and chide us when we do wrong, to provide us with the correct education, the correctly cleansed history, and to make sure we eat right and exercise the correct amount. After all, freedom is so messy and unseemly. It leads to disharmony.

Seeing Red said...

There's your man, Inga. Own him.

CouponMom said...

Libertarians are the Democrats base. They voted for Obama and Kerry.

Seeing Red said...

Via Drudge:

British ExxonMobil oil chief 'assassinated' in Brussels street

Exclusive: Nicholas Mockford, a British executive for the oil company ExxonMobil has been shot dead in front of his wife in an assassination-style killing in Brussels....

AF said...

"Beginning on 9/11/01."

Because they opposed the Iraq war?

Amexpat said...

I started transcribing

That's impressive as Paglia talks very fast. I think even an experienced stenographer would have problems keeping up with her.

Good interview, just wish Paglia wouldn't be so shy about her expressing her views.

gerry said...

Is government provided health insurance less Stalinist?

Medicare is optional. You buy it if you want it, you pay no penalty for not buying it (or any other health insurance).

That's a big difference.

Of course, Medicare will be bankrupt in - what was the latest from the CBO - six years?

traditionalguy said...

Camille likes to confront nonsense.

Her noticing that Obama supported and escalated the guaranteed useless Afghan 11 year and going War must be enlightening to our media's narrationists that GOP guys are war hawks.

The GOP guys believe in winnable short wars. Obama wanted to claim as his own the unwinnable, never ending sacrifice for nothing war.

virgil xenophon said...

Following on Nonapod/

The ever helpful Michell O: "All right, time for all you rich kids to get out for Volley-ball practice!" (It's for their own good and the good of the nation's healthcare fisc)

FleetUSA said...

She may be thinking of applying to the Tea Party

Clyde said...

So she's going to waste her vote by voting for Jill Stein? Seriously, folks, all of those people other than Obama or Romney cluttering up the presidential part of your ballot have exactly a 0.00% chance of getting any electoral votes at all, much less winning the election. Your choices are either Obama or Romney; anything else is a useless protest vote.

If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

Tank said...

The whole thing is a big ... duh.

Progressives are statists? What, this was some big surprise? Christ, she is the perfect example of a smart person lacking in wisdom.

AF said...

But the Obamacare is, to me, a Stalinist intrusion — okay? — into American culture.

And dammit, we want Stalinism on the state level only. Not the federal level.


Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner. Yes, Romney is not a conservative. He's a big gov't pro-business liberal. I know I've said this before.

Really, the election, it doesn't matter. We're going to get liberal alt #1 or liberal alt #2.

It will be the "make believe he hates war" liberal, or the "make believe he loves war liberal."

dreams said...

Who would have thought back in the sixties that the children of the greatest generation would turn out to be the sorriest generation. They were so spoiled by their affluent childhoods that they thought we needed a revolution. I grew up poor on a farm in rural KY and it never occurred to me to hate my country. I joined the Air Force at age 18 in Dec 1962 and when I got out in Dec 1966 we already had spoiled brats demonstrating on campuses all across the country.

We now know that these people ultimately became the professors and presidents of universities and they passed their privileged liberal viewpoint onto students including journalism students who think their job is to change the world by practicing liberal agenda journalism. And so too were the Dem political leaders influenced by these sixties type professors as were many of those in business, wall street and wherever.

The children of the greatest generation became the sorriest generation and the mess they created is all around us and they're going to pass that mess too onto the younger generations.

HA HA HA said...

That picture is Nigel Tufnel, isn't it? Or do I need new glasses?

garage mahal said...

Beginning on 9/11/01.

Ah yes. When America was attacked and George Bush enjoyed a 90% approval rating.

Just like how Republicans rallied around Obama after the Benghazi attacks.

garage mahal said...

Because we all know Republicans are the real Patriots, doncha know.

Methadras said...

Robert Cook said...

"He is a Marxist...."

Hahahahahaha!

At this late date, such delusion is astonishing to see.


Are you laughing because he isn't a marxist or because he just turned out not to be a very good one. Within your standards at least?

Seeing Red said...

We watched 9/11 - they watched Benghazi & lied.

AF said...

"Medicare is optional. You buy it if you want it, you pay no penalty for not buying it (or any other health insurance)."

No, you pay Medicare taxes whether you want Medicare or not. And they cost a lot more than the tax penalty for not buying insurance in Obamacare.

Bruce Hayden said...

My first thoughts, looking at the pictures, before reading Ann's text, was that this was a arts type post about Mick Jaggar. Sure kinda looks like him, though the lips aren't quite big enough.

Shouting Thomas said...

Just like how Republicans rallied around Obama after the Benghazi attacks.

Bush didn't lie about the source of the attacks and spend several weeks pretending that the cause was a video.

Nor did he order the perp walk of an American for the sin of exercising his First Amendment rights.

Cedarford said...

I like Paglia!
She is right about the Dems needing to be shattered so liberals and progressive Jews of power and wealth just knock off their superiority act about giving free entitlements and how they are all about CARING so much for the lesser rabble in poor neighborhoods they never encounter in life.

Of course, I think she would also be among the 1st to say that the Republicans also need some serious shattering.
To dislodge the "endless wars" Neocons, RTL Fundie goobers, the Grover Norquistians that want the wealthy to contribute nothing to America(joining the military? Hah!) or sacrifice (fair taxes> hah!)

Shouting Thomas said...

Of course, I think she would also be among the 1st to say that the Republicans also need some serious shattering. To dislodge the "endless wars" Neocons, RTL Fundie goobers, the Grover Norquistians that want the wealthy to contribute nothing to America(joining the military? Hah!) or sacrifice (fair taxes> hah!)

In other words, you hate everybody who's not exactly like you.

garage mahal said...

Bush didn't lie about the source of the attacks and spend several weeks pretending that the cause was a video.

Whatever dude. Romney was attacking Obama before the we even knew anyone had died. Real leadership there. The version of events in Libya told by Republicans neatly fit into a version of events they thought would hurt Obama to win an election.

Just like it took 14 days. Unemployment isn't lowering. Jeep is moving to China. GDP improvement isn't real. Obama is apologizing to the world.

It's all just fucking made up.

Darcy said...

@OriginalMike

And welcome news from MM! In addition to his secrets to making a good turkey soup which he shared here quite a while ago.

Shouting Thomas said...

Romney was attacking Obama before the we even knew anyone had died. Real leadership there.

Yes, that is real leadership.

You omit to mention that Romney was 100% correct.

pm317 said...

Better late than ever. All her reasons to reject O now were voiced in lefty blogs in 2008. Paglia is overrated.

Cedarford said...

Shouting Thomas -

Nor did he order the perp walk of an American for the sin of exercising his First Amendment rights.

Your 1st Amendment Hero:

1. Declared in his first video that he hoped to incite Muslims to harm Americans overseas in order to get more sympathy for Israel and the Copt Cause.
2. Was arrested for probation violation. He is a significant felon (bank fraud, identity theft, past conviction for setting up meth labs) and was in gross violation of rules he agreed to abide with in order to get his jail time reduced. He conned people again for financial gain, he used the internet to solicit funds, he was caught when arrested with 6 passports, 5 of which used other people's names and SS numbers.

In a sense, Nakoula is lucky the Feds are interested in him. They have the power cut a deal to reduce his jail time if he cooperates and reveals who his American and foreign financial backers were - that also intended Americans be targeted by angered Muslims over something that just isn't done in Muslim countries - Blaspheme the Prophet.

And no, most people outside the US do not give a flying fuck about what our Sacred Parchment says about some "1st Amendment" - anymore than Americans cared what the Nazi Party sacred parchments said or what the Muslims own Koran sacred parchment says.

Shouting Thomas said...

Your 1st Amendment Hero:

An American doesn't have to be a "hero," or even be sane or correct, to be entitled to the exercise of his First Amendment Rights.

pm317 said...

True lefty blogs like Riverdaughter.

James said...

I think the reference to Dylan's song is this:
":ook out kid, it's somethin' you did
God knows when, but you're doing it again
You better duck down the alleyway, lookin' for a new friend
The man in the coonskin cap in the pig pen
Wants eleven dollar bills, but you only got ten.
[...]
Look out kid, don't matter what you did
Walk on your tip toes, don't try No Doz
Better stay away from those that carry around a fire hose
Keep a clean nose, watch the plain clothes
You don't need a weather man to know which way the wind blows."

Cedarford said...

Shouting Thomas -

"In other words, you hate everybody who's not exactly like you."

No.
I just recognize both Parties have factions that are true cancers that hurt America and America's future by their undue power and influence over the democratic election process.

The harm to our countries best interests just doesn't come from one side, no matter how much blind partisans claim it is so.

Darcy said...

Oh, my God, garage, you are having a raging fever, right? That's the explanation. Has to be. Because nothing is ever WRONG in your mind unless someone on the right does it. Nothing. Oh, and BUUUUUUSH.

I am wishing you a speedy recovery. I mean that.

Christopher in MA said...

Just like how Republicans rallied around Obama after the Benghazi attacks.

Oh, you mean the attacks where the CIA was ordered to stand down? The attacks which encouraged Biden to ask a dead soldier's father "did your son always have balls the size of cue balls?"

You're not even a pigfucking hack, garage. You are subhuman slime. Go on, asshole - defend your Taupe Dope and his rotten regime. Spit on the Benghazi soldiers and the ambassador. It's what you've wanted to do since 9/12, so fly your colors proudly.

mark said...

@Garage "It's all just fucking made up."

Yeah the murdered men who defied the Obama administration to save fellow Americans were "made up".

The pools of blood of mexican children at a party murdered by guns from the Obama administration were "made up".

Sure.

And Obama can solve freshman math problems too.

Shouting Thomas said...

I just recognize both Parties have factions that are true cancers that hurt America and America's future by their undue power and influence over the democratic election process.

i.e., you like the land mass called the United States. It's just the people you hate.

Christopher in MA said...

Oh, my God, garage, you are having a raging fever, right? That's the explanation. Has to be. Because nothing is ever WRONG in your mind unless someone on the right does it. Nothing. Oh, and BUUUUUUSH.

I am wishing you a speedy recovery. I mean that.


Darcy, you recall on another thread I told you not to worry about expending Christian charity on loathsome swine like garbage. Now watch him on this thread or the Biden one. He'll do one of three things:

- blame Romney;
- vomit out some unconnected, witless snark;
- run away.

Neither he nor anyone in his treasonous party is worthy your consideration.


Chuck66 said...

Example of extreme statism.....almost all leading Democrats, including Obama, support so-called "pay equity" laws.

This is where an unelected fascist bureaucrat (and trial lawyers) will look at the pay of all of your employees, and then divide them into two groups: Those with penis' and those with virginas.

They do not look at:
-Resumes-performance reviews-education-co worker interviews to see how hard they work-missed work days-training- nothing. Just gender and pay.

Then they go after your business. Is this the kind of America you want to live in?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

"Medicare is optional. You buy it if you want it, you pay no penalty for not buying it (or any other health insurance)."

No, you pay Medicare taxes whether you want Medicare or not. And they cost a lot more than the tax penalty for not buying insurance in Obamacare.

AND if you chose not to buy Medicare Part B (Part A is included for the premiums you paid all your life) you get penalized every year that you don't buy into Part B.


So pay up sucka!!

Dust Bunny Queen said...

She is right about the Dems needing to be shattered...........the Republicans also need some serious shattering

Shattered.

garage mahal said...

Has to be. Because nothing is ever WRONG in your mind unless someone on the right does it. Nothing. Oh, and BUUUUUUSH.

Don't think I blamed BUUUUUUUSH for anything. I just correctly pointed out that liberals rallied around Bush after 9/11, and the Patriots in your party attacked Obama while dead bodies were still warm. Those are just facts.

Shouting Thomas said...

Don't think I blamed BUUUUUUUSH for anything. I just correctly pointed out that liberals rallied around Bush after 9/11, and the Patriots in your party attacked Obama while dead bodies were still warm. Those are just facts.

Those are not facts.

The facts are that Obama and Co. lied about the source of the attacks and fabricated a motive for the attacks from the beginning.

These attempts at evasion on your part are laughable, garage.

ricpic said...

How come the brilliant Paglia and the brilliant Althouse didn't get it that someone who sat in a pew in Black Liberation God Damn America Rev Wright's church for twenty years mightn't be the racial healing moderate their hearts longed for? Because the heart has its reasons to quote another great enlightened American.

Shouting Thomas said...

So, garage, your argument is that it's the patriotic duty of Americans to rally around a president who's lying, fabricating and violating the First Amendment?

There's a huge difference between Bush's actions after 9/11 and Obama actions from the moment the Benghazi attack occurred.

Darcy said...

Garage, as you know, the "attack" of which you speak from Romney wasn't about dead bodies. It was remarkably prescient and apt in hindsight though, no?

How do you feel about your government denying 3 requests to save those lives in that consulate? Watching while they died? And then standing next to their caskets and blaming a video?

How do you feel about that garage?

Seeing Red said...

VDH has a good article today about the distance in this country & in Europe. This blog is a microcosm.

garage mahal said...

The facts are that Obama and Co. lied about the source of the attacks and fabricated a motive for the attacks from the beginning.

Facts according to right wing blogs that lie about everything, sure.

Shouting Thomas said...

How do you feel about that garage?

He's already says how he feels.

It's out patriotic duty to support a President who's lying and who abandoned those men to die.

It's just like 9/11.

Shouting Thomas said...

Facts according to right wing blogs that lie about everything, sure.

So, you're still maintaining that the reason for the attacks was a video?

Even the Obama admin has abandoned that fairy tale.

Put aside the partisan hackery for a moment, garage, and talk sense.

Darcy said...

@Christopher in MA

I do get your point, however, in the length of time I've read this blog I feel like I know a different garage than this one. I like that guy.

Darcy said...

I think if it's true that orders were given to stand down after requests to for help to save the lives in Benghazi, we should see some criminal prosecution.

That's not a judgment call. That's negligence at minimum.

Christopher in MA said...

I do get your point, however, in the length of time I've read this blog I feel like I know a different garage than this one. I like that guy.

The point is that there is no different garage, Darcy. It's like Obama during the third debate. With Benghazi the mask is off and the real, party-before-country, fuck-the-military, some-eggs-have-to-be-broken-to-elect-Democrats garage is here to behold.

Facts according to right wing blogs that lie about everything, sure.

****

Don't think I blamed BUUUUUUUSH for anything. I just correctly pointed out that liberals rallied around Bush after 9/11, and the Patriots in your party attacked Obama while dead bodies were still warm. Those are just facts.


Didn't I tell you his response would likely be worthless snark? It's because he is, at bottom, a worthless creature; a crawling, cringing homunculus not worthy to breathe the same air as free men.

Your charity speaks well of you. But one should be careful of casting pearls before swine.

garage mahal said...

ST

Case in point:

Romney:

"I saw a story today that one of the great manufacturers in this state Jeep — now owned by the Italians — is thinking of moving all production to China," Romney said at a rally in Defiance, Ohio, home to a General Motors powertrain plant. "I will fight for every good job in America. I'm going to fight to make sure trade is fair, and if it's fair America will win."

Reality:

Despite clear and accurate reporting, the take has given birth to a number of stories making readers believe that Chrysler plans to shift all Jeep production to China from North America, and therefore idle assembly lines and U.S. workforce. It is a leap that would be difficult even for professional circus acrobats.
Let’s set the record straight: Jeep has no intention of shifting production of its Jeep models out of North America to China. It’s simply reviewing the opportunities to return Jeep output to China for the world’s largest auto market. U.S. Jeep assembly lines will continue to stay in operation. A careful and unbiased reading of the Bloomberg take would have saved unnecessary fantasies and extravagant comments.

Shouting Thomas said...

And, now the attempt to change the subject.

Anga2010 said...

I was so impressed by this woman that I went to the Althouse Amazon search and bought her book!
Not terribly interested in art history or boomer generation thought processes, but I expect to be fascinated by the book.

Shouting Thomas said...

Let's take that PR statement apart, garage.

First the denial:


Let’s set the record straight: Jeep has no intention of shifting production of its Jeep models out of North America to China.

Then the admission that Romney was correct:

It’s simply reviewing the opportunities to return Jeep output to China for the world’s largest auto market.

Can you read?

LordSomber said...

So much of this stuff was obvious even back in 2008.
Is the sputtering anger and "shock" some kind of moral CYA move?

garage mahal said...

The point is that there is no different garage, Darcy.

Whatever Darcy thinks of me, I guarantee she would befriend me in real life before a miserable freak like you. I seriously would not wish being you on my worst enemy.

garage mahal said...

ST
Jeep intends to sell more Jeeps to China, not move production there.

LilyBart said...


Wow, that was awesome. Except I had it figured out in 2008.

(No Name) said...

But you're still in the tank for Obama, right?

Shouting Thomas said...

You misread the PR bit, garage.

Admit it.

Jeep did say that they were "thinking" about precisely what Romney said they were "thinking" about.

The PR bit (and that's all it is) that you produced is a CYA memo. Obviously, Romney caused some consternation in Jeep HQ and they decided they'd better repair the damage.

Whiskey said...

This is why White, educated, Upper Class women are a bane on America. They vote their feelings and frankly, sexual desire, not a fairly bloodless, analytical comparison of candidates. This group of women (and Ms. Althouse is a perfect example, frankly) votes their vagina, to put it bluntly. Not their head.

No one looking at the actual career, writings, and behavior of Barack Obama would be the least bit surprised. Most White men did not vote for him, because not being taken in by "feelings" and that special tingling feeling down there (Chris Matthews the exception perhaps) they looked at the man's record, speeches, actions, votes, background, and pretty much penciled in what he has actually done as President. McCain was frankly a terrible candidate, and would have made a bad President, but a less bad one and bad in lesser and different ways than Obama.

But White educated women wanted a fantasy sex figure (see Lena Dunham, Sarah Silverman, those writers in the NYT) and put in place a guy who is nothing more than a thinner version of Al Sharpton.

To be honest, I blame Althouse, and those women like her, who provided the margin of victory to Obama in 2008. I may not be a Law Professor, but I'm not so foolish as to vote my sexual urges instead of an analytical assessment of what is basically the job of "Head Coach" for America -- one with awesome powers and thus a decision based on analysis not "feelings."

Marshal said...

I just correctly pointed out that liberals rallied around Bush after 9/11,

Back in reality, leftist politicians supported the war on terror after 9-11 because they were afraid the public would penalize them electorally if they didn't. But unelected leftist institutions, academia foremost, immediately began blaming America for the attacks with the media mainstreaming that accusation as best they could. Leftist politicians undermined the President wherever they could, going so far as to outline their intention to break with the 9-11 investigation and criticize Republicans for stonewalling before the 9-11 commission had even begun the investigation.

But to garage, AF, and the rest of the leftists simply stating that Democrats "rallied around the President" makes it true.

What tools.

tom swift said...

Paglia is insufferable. Slow of comprehension and years late to the party, (no, not the Party), and ultimately ineffectual (vote for Stein? How insufferably precious). Perhaps the weirdest thing is her substitution for what she remembers of the popular culture of her youth for a solid knowledge of history. A man learns from his mistakes ... a wise man learns from the mistakes of others. The guy who warned us about the inevitable outcome of the Progressive monstrosity wasn't Dylan ... the warnings came from examination of the careers of guys like Benito and Adolf.

garage mahal said...

Jeep did say that they were "thinking" about precisely what Romney said they were "thinking" about.

You guys are hopeless. Chrysler is expanding and adding jobs here, to meet demand:

About 1,100 new Chrysler employees will begin working next week on a third crew at Jefferson North Assembly Plant in Detroit as sales of Jeep Grand Cherokees continue to rise. Link

roesch/voltaire said...

And obviously Paglia won't vote for Romney because he is just another drone of Obama--

Christopher in MA said...

Whatever Darcy thinks of me, I guarantee she would befriend me in real life before a miserable freak like you. I seriously would not wish being you on my worst enemy.

And my point to her stands. You still have nothing at all to say about our men being cut down in Benghazi except to snark about Romney and Jeep.

I'm sure Darcy would befriend you. After seeing your true self on display today, however, I hope - with all of my heart - that you die. Very soon and in abject agony.

J. E. Burke said...

Me too, exactly. The Democratic Party has become the party of affluent professionals who have little in common with the people they pretend to represent -- the party of Cambridge, Manhattan and Hyde Park which commands the votes of 95 percent of African Americans and 65 percent of Latinos by polarizing everything by race, a strategy made all the easier with a Black President. FDR, Truman and JFK would not recognize this party as theirs.

Saint Croix said...

I hope - with all of my heart - that you die. Very soon and in abject agony.

It's like Godwin's law, except with voodoo dolls.

Basil said...

Chrysler is an Italian company, given to Fiat by President Obama through a pre-packaged bankruptcy. Outsourced the entire company.

Cornfed said...

Well said, Whiskey. I love Paglia and her insights. But the thing that is so weird is why anyone was surprised by Obama. He is, and always has been, a leftist, statist, racially polarizing, regulation-happy, redistributive liberal. The slightest effort to examine his record made it plain from the start. Lots of people were pointing this out four years ago, yes? It's only willful blindness that could cause one to overlook these things.

Basil said...

Chrysler is an Italian company, given to Fiat by President Obama through a pre-packaged bankruptcy. Outsourced the entire company.

Darcy said...

I'm sure Darcy would befriend you.

I would.

And I don't think I'll ever get used to the casual internet death wishes. I winced.

bagoh20 said...

"Just like how Republicans rallied around Obama after the Benghazi attacks."

What are you talking about, he was immediately surrounded by throngs of Americans at his fundraiser in Las Vegas. I wanted to go to Vegas too, but I had a job to do.

wildswan said...

What's interesting to me about this interview is that this acceptable-at-liberal-dinner-tables-person is saying that the Democrats need a Tea-Party-type shakeup. I mean I could now say to blinded-liberal relatives "what do you think of Paglia's argument that the Democratic Party is out of touch?" That would be more possible than saying my actual thoughts. I guess Paglia wouldn't like to think of herself as a halfway house for addicts to liberalism who are trying to negotiate a return to real life but she is. Truth to tell, I like her and I always have; we came from the same background and walked the same road and came to the same crossroad in a wood a long time ago. She went on to Liberal-land but she's still honest there among the Grotesques and still knows a good picture or poem when she sees one and knows to value it. Shouldn't that count?
PS. No, she doesn't get conservatives; yes, I do see that.

Michael said...

Garage: That is good news, if true, about the Chrysler Jeep plant. I think it is the only vehicle in their line that makes money. It should be spun off as a separate entity before Chrysler takes the third and final count. They can build Jeeps at a profit down here in the south with right to work rules.

viator said...

I just read Jill Stein's platform. Reads like Obama on steroids

Christopher in MA said...

And I don't think I'll ever get used to the casual internet death wishes. I winced.

It isn't casual, Darcy.

Our ambassador and brave SEALs were murdered by barbarians as they called - begged! - for help, and this feckless nitwit on two legs calling itself president wouldn't so much as say "do something."

And garage supports the man. Won't even address the story. Calls it right wing fantasy.

There is nothing too awful that should not happen to a party-over-all hack like that.

Which is all I will say. I am done with garage forever, except only to look forward to his election eve meltdown when his criminal party gets the thumping it so richly deserves.

Rob Crawford said...

Was arrested for probation violation. He is a significant felon (bank fraud, identity theft, past conviction for setting up meth labs) and was in gross violation of rules he agreed to abide with in order to get his jail time reduced. He conned people again for financial gain, he used the internet to solicit funds, he was caught when arrested with 6 passports, 5 of which used other people's names and SS numbers.

First, the "parole violation" line is BS -- you don't send armed men in the middle of the night to the home of a non-violent felon over accusations of a non-violent, possible parole violation. He was arrested because he was inconvenient for the Obama administration -- they hoped that by squashing him like a bug, they could quiet the "Arab Street".

As for the rest -- so what? Dig into the guy "Miranda Rights" are named after.

Once upon a time, "liberals" said if we didn't protect the rights of the most despised, no one would have rights. I had no idea that was their plan.

dsm said...

Speaking of "white upper-middle-class liberals lubricating themselves", please read my latest on Claire McCaskill. Not only did you, the taxpayer, buy her husband a portfolio of Section 8 housing worth tens, probably hundreds of millions of dollars, but you have the privilege of subsidizing the rent of their impoverished tenants. McCaskill's part of America's poverty-industrial complex generates at least $2.2 million annually.

Q said...

When was the American left not statist, not Stalinist? It's always been about the belief that absolute power in the hands of good people - by which they mean themselves - is a good thing. It's a political philosophy which by definition contains no built-in limits on what government can do. Can the government execute all left-handed people? Of course it can! That's why you need to elect left-handed-friendly Democrats!

As for the belief that Barack Obama would be a "racial healer", I can understand that some of those "low information voters" who get their news from watching Jon Stewart might fall for that, but there was an abundance of data indicating that Obama was a black racist in 2007. There's no excuse for Althouse and Paglia to not have known what sort of man he was.

Rob Crawford said...

I just correctly pointed out that liberals rallied around Bush after 9/11,

It's not "correct" -- it's an absolute lie. The "liberals" were marching for "peace" by the following Saturday; the ruins were still smoking and they were screaming about "American murderers"!

garage mahal said...

Which is all I will say. I am done with garage forever

I wish. You'll be back with some violent death/rape fantasies about me and other people you don't like. Because you're seriously fucked up in the head and you cannot help yourself.

Henry said...

One has to wonder about how much innate intelligence any reasonably-informed person who still voted for a Chicago machine politician actually has. Thus, it's hard to take the political opinions of such folk very seriously: they simply are not very bright.

Rob Crawford said...

When was the American left not statist, not Stalinist?

There was a brief period when they were Leninist, and one when they were pro-Mussolini, and one where Hitler was there guy.

Oh, and don't forget the Maoists! ISTR one of them in the president's cabinet.

Rob Crawford said...

Because you're seriously fucked up in the head and you cannot help yourself.

Projection -- it's what's for dinner!

Marshal said...

Christopher in MA said...

And garage supports the man. Won't even address the story. Calls it right wing fantasy.


The penalty for idiocy is not death but ridicule.

Robert Cook said...

"Paglia wouldn't recognize an actual member of the middle class if she was run over by a Ford F150 playing 'Sweet Home Alabama' on the sound system."

Umm...Shouting Tom, someone driving a Ford pickup playing Lynyrd Skynyrd (who used to play at my high school, BTW) is more likely working class than middle class...if we're talking class signifiers here.

'course, I'm assuming you're referring to an older Ford F150, a working vehicle--a pickup truck--rather than the newer, bigger, more bloated SUV-style vehicle.

Skynyrd is always the working man's band.

Sigivald said...

I thought he was a moderate.

So she wanted to vote for a moderate in 2008, but now she's voting for Jill Stein?

So, has she eschewed moderation, or is she using the term in a way that defies comprehension and applying it to the Greens?

(I must side with Methadras - the problem is not that the Democrats are inadequately "progressive". It's that they are Progressives.

And that's ugly and unpopular when it's actually implemented.

What's a "true progressive root" even look like?)

LoafingOaf said...

Althouse: "Most of the interview is about art in America and her new book "Glittering Images" (which I just bought, in Kindle)."

You like Kindle that much? I ask because Paglia said this to Salon.com about her new book:

Then while writing it, I thought, oh my God, I’m trying to do an art book in the age of the Kindle — am I out of my mind? This is never going to work! So another reason I wanted to keep it short was I was in anguish that it was going to end up way too expensive, and by the time this book was done, they weren’t going to want to do it. But to my absolute amazement, once the book was submitted last fall, I suddenly realized that Random House was going to put its full force of production and design into this book. I really had no idea! Precisely because of the Kindle, they now wanted to show the world what a book can be as an object — to re-intoxicate people with the beauty of books. Random House has devoted so much energy and expense into the high-quality printing and glossy paper.

So, I'm gonna get the print edition.

Link is here.

There's a lot more about her thoughts on Democrats, Republicans, and Obama at that link too.

Robert Cook said...

"There's a huge difference between Bush's actions after 9/11 and Obama actions from the moment the Benghazi attack occurred."

Yes, both lied, but we'd be much better off if Bush had acted after 9/11 more like Obama after Benghazi.

Marshal said...

Robert Cook said...
"There's a huge difference between Bush's actions after 9/11 and Obama actions from the moment the Benghazi attack occurred."

Yes, both lied


What did Bush lie about?

gadfly said...

I don't know Camille Paglia at all, had never before heard of her and I don't much care what she thinks about Obama and things political - simply because she remains a squishy liberal as best as I can determine.

So how come she gets an Instalanche and attention from popular blogger Ann Althouse? Beats the crap out of me!

Q said...

Yes, both lied, but we'd be much better off if Bush had acted after 9/11 more like Obama after Benghazi.


We'd be much better off if Bush had responded to 9/11 by flying off to Vegas for a fund-raiser?

AllenS said...

Not all, but by far, most commenters here at this blog had all of this shit figured out from the get go.

Shouting Thomas said...

'course, I'm assuming you're referring to an older Ford F150, a working vehicle--a pickup truck--rather than the newer, bigger, more bloated SUV-style vehicle.

Cookie, you are apparently unaware of how prosperous some (if not many) of those working (middle class) guys are.

Many of the working (middle class) guys I know in my family and in the music biz drive the $60,000 luxury four-door version of the F150 to their jobs as concrete contractors and building contractors.

Blue collar guys aren't necessarily poor. In fact, they are often better off than their middle class counterparts.

Shouting Thomas said...

And, Cookie, before you stick your feet deeper into this shit...

I routinely play at Rod and Gun clubs frequented by those blue collar good old boys. They are definitely middle class.

And, the parking lot is always filled with dozens of $40,000 to $60,000 Ford F150s and Dodge RAMs.

Cedarford said...

Rob Crawford - "First, the "parole violation" line is BS -- you don't send armed men in the middle of the night to the home of a non-violent felon over accusations of a non-violent, possible parole violation. He was arrested because he was inconvenient for the Obama administration -- they hoped that by squashing him like a bug, they could quiet the "Arab Street".

As for the rest -- so what? Dig into the guy "Miranda Rights" are named after."

First, all cops are armed. And no, they do not disarm themselves when going in to arrest "non-violent" junkies, ex-meth lab organizers, brabk fraud cons violating parole.

Second, over 1/3rd of the people in jail in California are those that violated probation.

Third, this asshole publicly and visibly violated his probation - forcing his probie officer to flag him for rearrest and jailing.

4th - And this is the most important, there IS NO 4TH Amendement for people on probation. Many have restrictions on their 5th Amendment rights - they can't refuse to answer questions on possible probation violation. That in itself is a probation violation. They also have restrictions on their 2nd and 1st Amendment rights, depending on their offenses they were convicted of.
Only when probation is complete are their rights in whole or partially restored. (Many convicted felons of course are barred from voting, gun ownership by law - for lifetime)

Shouting Thomas said...

Cedarford, that entire load of verbage you just downloaded is completely irrelevant.

This guy would never have been noticed or busted if Obama hadn't needed a scapegoat.

In other words, this is a direct assault on the First Amendment.

etbass said...

Go Bagho at 10:18. Go!

Robert Cook said...

Shouting Tom, I have no doubt what you say about your blue collar buddies is true.

But as a rhetorical device, calling up the image of a guy in a pickup blasting Skynyrd does not denote "middle class," but "working class."

Whereas there is overlap in reality, the terms refer to distinct economic classes when used in rhetoric.

That's why I said "if we're talking about class signifiers."

The rhetorical device that would have better denoted middle class would have been something like "Paglia wouldn't know 'middle class' if Ward Cleaver invited her to the house for chicken croquets."

This is about use of appropriate rhetoric to make your point vividly. Your image confused your point.

Michael K said...

Robert Cook said...

"There's a huge difference between Bush's actions after 9/11 and Obama actions from the moment the Benghazi attack occurred."

Yes, both lied, but we'd be much better off if Bush had acted after 9/11 more like Obama after Benghazi.


Bush derangement syndrome lives !

Robert Cook said...

"What did Bush lie about?"

That Hussein had something to do with 9/11. That Hussein was associated with Al Qaeda. That Hussein had active stores of WMD and was close to having a nuke. That Hussein was a threat to America. That Hussein had intention to supply Al Qaeda or similar groups with WMD to deploy against us. That, when his imminent nukes were extant, Hussein could shoot them in rockets to our shores within 45 minutes. That if we did not invade Iraq we would face some sort of almost-certain annihilation at the hands of Hussein.

Real American said...

I was very excited about him. I thought he was a moderate. I thought that his election would promote racial healing in the country.

There are words for people who thought that: Sap. Sucker. Fool. Dupe. Instapundit goes with Rube.

Not all of us were fooled. We saw the media-spun foundation of sand bullshit from the beginning. There was no evidence for any of the moderate, race healing crap. We knew he was a far left zealot, not to mention incompetent and unaccomplished. We knew he'd be a disaster, a divider.

Advice to the rubes: the people who were right then, are right now, too. Use better judgment this time around.

David said...

When someone flees a burning house only after their clothes catch on fire, you consider them dumb beyond measure.
Remind you of anyone on this page?

Jim Treacher said...

If you're voting for anybody but Romney, you're voting for Obama. Welcome to Earth.

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