December 31, 2012

"It is shockingly inexpensive to travel within Turkey by plane."

"Take this segment: from Istanbul to Izmir (about an hour flying time) on Atlas Jet, it's $25 (without additional discounts). For this, we get not only the flight itself, but a warm snack (melted cheese sandwich, cake, coffee or a soft drink) and, too, upon arrival in Izmir, free transportation by bus to towns south of us. Including to Slecuk — another hour's worth of travel."

... worth of travel.

Do you understand it?

34 comments:

pm317 said...

Do you understand it?

Yes, very well.

Ann, curiosity question. . how come we don't see you travel outside the US?

rehajm said...

Clearly Nina is a woman who enjoys the journey...

I do not fully understand the economics. The fare cannot cover the cost of production. My first thought was heavy government subsidies. Atlas jet is privately held, so it isn't obvious to me where the subsidy is coming from and how it is working. But I'll find it...

It could also be the travel leg is a loss leader, where some combination of positioning of people and equipment feeds passengers to higher paying fares, justifying the low cost....

Mitchell the Bat said...

Friends toured Turkey, not too long ago, with their infant daughter. Blond hair, blue eyes.

Complete strangers would approach and ask if they could hold the baby.

"You have somewhere to go? I watch."

My friend met with some business associates, while in Turkey, and they offered him some local hospitality . . . the services of a young girl. When my friend politely declined, they offered him a young boy.

There's more but you get the idea.

The Turks are a charming people.

Ann Althouse said...

"Ann, curiosity question. . how come we don't see you travel outside the US?"

I don't want to.

Ann Althouse said...

I don't like to get in planes. Haven't you noticed?

Ann Althouse said...

I don't like all the elaborate hassles of traveling, the hemorrhaging of money, the endless searching for a place to eat, the never-as-good-as-home hotels...

At home, I know the food will be good, the bed will be very comfortable, I'll have everything I need, we have the beauty of normal life, etc. etc.

How can travel ever beat home? I throw myself out of home once in a while, but I prefer the simplicity of getting in the car and going somewhere in America. You'll never see all of America.

In less than 2 weeks, I'll be eligible for a lifetime pass to the national parks for only $10! I'm always happy to go to a national park.

Sabinal said...

Mitchell's story about their friend's daughter is funny considering the founder of Turkey was born in Greece (Ottoman Empire) and had blond hair and blue eyes like his mom

http://eyeforknowledge.wordpress.com/2012/06/12/was-mustafa-kemal-ataturk-jewish-andor-subservient-to-jewish-world-agenda/

and his mom Zubeyde

http://www.gunlukkitap.com/politika-ve-siyaset/12155-12184-zubeyde-hanim-golgesinde-mustafa-kemal-i-buyuten-kadin-9786055943561.html

one of the cheapest routes to Paris is through Istanbul (Turkish airlines). You have to literally spend a day but you have two country visits under your belt :)


somefeller said...

I generally travel within the US, because there is a lot to see and you can never see it all. One of the benefits of living in a nation that is the size of a continental empire. But Istanbul is a special place and worth the hassles of travel. Ancient history next to modern commerce, and not a city that feels like its only industry is tourism.

Amexpat said...

Generally, it's much easier to find really cheap fares in Europe than in the US. I recently flew four hours from Malaga,Spain to Oslo for $30 with Ryan Air. I'll most likely repeat that in a few weeks time.

Lyle said...

Yep, just got back from a road trip to New Mexico.

Beautiful state with interesting people.


I feel for your anxiety Professor Althouse. I have a tremendous fear of heights. It's more nerve-racking for me to drive around in the mountains then to fly for some strange reason. And I like the mountains too.

Amexpat said...

"I do not fully understand the economics. The fare cannot cover the cost of production. My first thought was heavy government subsidies."

Low cost airlines now make most of the profit on non flight revenue. Ryan air has one of the most visited websites in Europe. To book a flight you have to click through many pages with ads. They also get inexperienced travelers to buy expensive and unneeded travel insurance. On board they sell food, drinks, duty free and lottery tickets.

They do get some indirect government subsidies by pressing airports for low rates, which some local governments will support for extra tourist revenue.

Tank said...

Travelling. It's weird. Like taste. You like something, or you don't. It's not really rational (AA has some explanation, but I reject that). For every downside there are upsides, IF you enjoy them. I do. I love to travel. Others find the hassle greater than the enjoyment.

Amazingly, I was in Turkey, and went to Ephesus - a remarkable site. Shopping there is a trip. It's worth travelling all the way there just for the sight of Istanbul from your ship as you arive. Like travelling to another century. I was there with a group. Not sure I'd go myself now, being Jewish and all.

66 said...

I must say, I love the Nina posts. Her compact descriptions are charming and a good read. And her photography is improving.

MayBee said...

I recently went to Istanbul but didn't travel around Turkey. I'm not currently living in the US and I love traveling to different countries.

However, I do hate people who act superior for their love of travel, and love of foreign travel. I agree with Tank. It's something you enjoy or you don't.

Dan said...

Ha! Thanks for the tip about the Senior Pass for National Parks. I have been qualified for the past 7 months and did not know it.

MayBee said...

I shouldn't say I hate people who act superior.
I hate it when people act superior.

Michael K said...

Ephesus has an enormous theater. It gives you an idea of how large the city was at one time. There is also a cute example of ancient advertising. Near the end of the street to the harbor, there are, carved into the pavement, the imprint of foot steps leading up into the city. The carved steps contain Greek instructions on the brothels that the steps lead to.

The Turks have preserved Florence Nightingale's office and quarters in one tower of the Scutari Barracks where she cared for wounded British soldiers in 1853. The rest of the barracks is an army headquarters.

edutcher said...

Since 9/11 and, particularly, since Dictator Zero, I'm a tad dicey about venturing outside the good old US of A.

pm317 said...

Ann, curiosity question. . how come we don't see you travel outside the US?

I do believe she also has a fear of heights.

Insufficiently Sensitive said...

It's perfectly understandable. One might wonder why Turkey is subsidizing tourist travel so lavishly - or is the subsidy for the airline? Does it relate to Turkey's hope to get in the EU?

nina said...

I have two daughters: one loves to travel, the other hates it. It's just the way it is.

Me, I've always wanted to see other places -- especially far away places where people did things differently than back home.

Turkey is special. The people make it so, despite the fact that most of us foreigners can't speak a word of their language. Mersi (thank you). That's all I know in Turkish. Often times okay is all they know in English. And still, somehow, mostly we all manage.

Antisemitism, racism, nationalism, sexism -- tell me what country has none of those? Last time I traveled in Turkey, I was with just my daughter. This time I'm traveling with someone who is without question Jewish. Neither time have I ever had trouble here. Not to say that it can't happen, here or anywhere else for that matter. But it's rare here.

In the matter of cheap flights -- I don't know how Atlas Jet does it. They are not so add on crazy like Ryan Air. I think they pick their routes carefully and fly full planes.

In the matter of the inconvenience of travel -- I get so excited about getting there that I hardly notice the downside of getting there.

Thanks, Ann, as always. And others too, esp. 66 who comments that my photos are improving! :) In my defense, I mostly point and shoot. Photography is important to me, but not so much that it should slow us down in any way.

MayBee said...

The average Turkish monthly salary is quite low (less than $1000 USD). Interior travel would be priced for them.

Amexpat said...

"I have two daughters: one loves to travel, the other hates it. It's just the way it is."

I suspect that there is a genetic component involved. Some people have nomadic blood and need to travel.



David said...

"Ephesus was once (in Greek and Roman times -- think 1st century B.C.) the major port of the the Mediterranean (the silting up of the harbor pushed it inland by several miles)."

The environmental degradation of the ancient era! At Ephesus and many other old Mediterranean ports, the occupants destroyed the forest for building materials, fuel and defense. This caused erosion which silted the harbors. In some places it occurred astonishingly quickly. Her photo of the town and hillside, which Nina calls lovely, shows the damage even today. I find that landscape rather unattractive. Nina is in love (with travel) so she see it as beautiful.

Sandy Daze said...

I was booking a ticket for my daughter to return to college (Hillsdale) from Christmas break. Norfolk to Detroit was USD $160, but I was able to book a flight Norfolk to Tampa to visit grandparents for a few days and then Tampa to Detroit for a grand total of USD $120 (both flights) !

Is this a great country or what?

Southwest. It's not LUV for nothing...

Oso Negro said...

I spent more than that on gasoline driving from Izmir to Istanbul back in June.

will stevens said...

The 10 bucks for the National parks senior pass is the best bargain anywhere. I got mine a few years ago at Denali and have been to probably 20 more parks since.
As for Turkey...I was there in 1970. I was on a US Navy destroyer which visited Izmir and Alanya. The Turks hated us sailors and we had problems wherever we traveled on land. I have been to a lot of places in the world and Turkey is at the bottom of any list I can conjure up, as far as places I would like to visit.

heyboom said...

I have been a pilot for most of my adult life and now fly professionally. Absolutely love it, but you will never see me walk out onto that glass sky walk at the Grand Canyon or ride a glass elevator up the side of a skyscraper. I have a very strong fear of heights in those situations.

I still haven't quite figured out that dynamic yet.

southcentralpa said...

Given the disturbing Islamist trend in Turkey, they may need to offer these kind of prices to get anyone to come.

Shame, really.

pm317 said...

My love of travel came to me when I was 23+ and went to Amsterdam for a year. After that tour, we (I and hubby) decided to go back to India and 'settle' down. Settle down we did for 5 months and got so bored (with everything being so familiar and safe) that we took the first opportunity to come to the US -- that was 26 years ago. Living in a different culture and living a life like the locals do is the challenge that we like, though living in the US is really not much of a challenge. Now we travel and where ever we go we try to blend in with the locals -- park like a local is our gold standard.
I am very jealous of Nina and her travels.

Incidentally my husband has fear of heights which he has overcome to a large extent but he absolutely has no fear of flying.

Rusty said...

Ann Althouse said...
I don't like to get in planes. Haven't you noticed?

I don't blame you.

Rusty said...

Ann Althouse said...
I don't like all the elaborate hassles of traveling, the hemorrhaging of money, the endless searching for a place to eat, the never-as-good-as-home hotels...

At home, I know the food will be good, the bed will be very comfortable, I'll have everything I need, we have the beauty of normal life, etc. etc.

How can travel ever beat home? I throw myself out of home once in a while, but I prefer the simplicity of getting in the car and going somewhere in America. You'll never see all of America.


We're related.

In less than 2 weeks, I'll be eligible for a lifetime pass to the national parks for only $10! I'm always happy to go to a national park.

Fer real? How old you have to be?

enderud said...

Mitchell the Bat:

"My friend met with some business associates, while in Turkey, and they offered him some local hospitality . . . the services of a young girl. When my friend politely declined, they offered him a young boy."

Unlike in the Arab countries, pederasty is not commonly practiced in Turkey. Perhaps your friend's business associates thought it was an American custom.

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